Israel Pisses on Britain (Again)

On Tuesday the Israeli navy, in a blatant act of piracy on the high seas, assaulted the vessel ‘Spirit of Humanity’ and abducted six British nationals who were taking part in a voyage of mercy. The tiny unarmed ship was bringing a humanitarian cargo of medicines, children’s toys and reconstruction materials to the devastated people of Gaza.

Israel’s murderous 22-day offensive last December/January left more than 50,000 homes, 800 industrial properties, 200 schools, 39 mosques and two churches damaged or destroyed. The International Committee of the Red Cross says the 1.5 million Palestinians living in Gaza are “trapped in despair”, unable to rebuild their lives because Israel, having wantonly wrecked their civil society and infrastructure, is blocking efforts to bring in the necessary repair materials. Those on board the Spirit of Humanity were acting in accord with donors’ pledges of $4.5 billion for reconstruction and rehabilitation and US President Obama’s request to Israel to let those supplies pass.

The mercy ship sailed from Larnaca, Cyprus, with a crew of 21 human rights activists, humanitarian workers and journalists from 11 different countries, including Nobel laureate Mairead Maguire and former US Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney. In the early hours of Tuesday morning Israeli warships surrounded it and threatened to open fire if the crew didn’t turn back. When they refused to be intimidated, the Israelis jammed their instrumentation and blocked their GPS, radar, and navigation systems, putting all lives at risk.

The ship had been searched and given security clearance by the Port Authorities in Cyprus before sailing, and posed no threat.

Richard Falk, the United Nations special rapporteur on human rights, says the seizing of the Spirit of Humanity is unlawful and the continuing blockade of Gaza a crime against humanity. Yes, yes, Mr Falk. But the question as always is, what is your paralytic, useless organization doing about it? Or is hand-wringing all it’s good for?

Many here, including myself, immediately wrote to David Miliband, the British foreign secretary, about the outrage. Two days later I called the Palestine desk at the Foreign Office in London. The person I spoke to sounded uncomfortable having to trot out the same old gobbledigook about “working hard to resolve the problem” and “doing all we can”. He said the six Brits were in Israeli custody and nobody was sure where exactly the incident took place. However, the vessel was fitted with a SPOT GPS tracker, so the system should have a record of their position when attacked.

The real problem, as I suggested, is that Israel dares to kidnap Brits on the high seas and doesn’t fear the consequences – no doubt confident there won’t be any. I was reminded that Israel had issued warnings (and so had the Foreign Office) not to travel in that area. What area? Mustn’t one travel in international waters?

The spokesman assured me that progress was being made. There was “movement” on getting humanitarian supplies into Gaza, but I pointed out that nobody had seen any evidence of Israel conforming with international law and Geneva Conventions. He claimed there was also “movement” on halting settlements on occupied territory, although I observed that the Israelis had just OK’d more illegal building.

I also reminded him about the ramming of the MV Dignity on a similar mission by an Israeli gunboat on 30 December, 53 miles from shore, and how people here were still hopping mad that nothing had been done about it. The vessel, with 16 on board, was badly damaged and had to limp to a safe Lebanese port. As far as I know, there was never an offer of compensation and no demand from London. As usual, somebody else had to pick up the tab for Israel’s unbridled destruction.

The Dignity had a cargo of 3.5 tonnes of medical supplies, the majority donated by the Cyprus government, and a British skipper and a Greek mate. It carried fourteen passengers, one of whom was Cynthia McKinney. There were also two surgeons and a Palestinian physician. A friend of mine was among them and wrote this chilling account of the attack…

At 04.55 hrs EMT on 30 December, searchlights appeared astern. There were two Israeli gunboats. They came abreast, circled and stayed with us. These boats can do over 45 knots, carry ten tonnes of fuel and have sophisticated weapon systems including Hellfire missiles. Tracer bullets were fired skywards, forming ellipses, and flares put up. At 05.30 hrs approximately, one gunboat was playing its searchlight on the port side of ‘Dignity’. Suddenly there was a tremendous crash at the bow, and then another almost simultaneously, and another on the port beam… The bow dipped and it seemed the boat was breaking up. It was dark, the wind force was 4 to 5 and there was a 10ft sea. The master shouted ‘we have been rammed’. It was feared the boat would sink. He broadcast a Mayday distress signal; there was no response.

Cynthia McKinney and Caoimhe Butterly could not swim; the life jackets were rapidly deployed to all. The hull was taking water but bilge pumps were working. The first words from a commander of one of the gun boats came over the radio. First there was the accusation that the ship’s company was involved with terrorists and that it was subversive. Then there came the threat to shoot. The master was forbidden from making for Gaza or further south to El Arish in Egypt. He was ordered to return to Larnaca – about 160 miles, even though the boat was badly damaged and the Israeli did not know whether there was sufficient fuel, which there was not. He set a northerly course and the boat stayed buoyant in a moderating sea. A crew member arranged with the Lebanese authorities for a safe harbour in Sour (Tyre) where jubilant crowds thronged the quays. A UNIFIL ship came out to escort us and the Israeli gunboats, which were following, fell back.

Was there lethal intent? A gunboat came out of the black of night with no lights showing whilst a searchlight from the other gun boat displayed our port hull as its target. It would have approached at about 30 degrees to the Dignity’s port and at speed. The intention to sink the Dignity and thus to drown its company was clear. If the hull had been GRP (Glass Reinforced Plastic) it would have shattered and the boat would have sunk like a stone 53 nautical miles off Haifa. Fortunately, the hull was constructed of marine ply with timber ribs and survived…. The ship’s company were repatriated except for a resolute Scot, Theresa McDermott. She was imprisoned in Ramleh gaol. When the British Consulate in Israel was contacted for assistance in finding Teresa, staff refused to help locate her saying they couldn’t provide assistance to a UK citizen unless she personally requested it. Teresa was released after six days, her ‘crime’ probably being a member of the International Solidarity Campaign like Rachel Corrie before her.

My written question to Mr Miliband was simply this: “Why isn’t Her Majesty’s Government providing the mercy ship ‘Spirit of Humanity’ with an escort to protect against the unlawful, piratical interference and threat to life by the Israeli navy? There have been repeated incidents of harassment, damage, theft and armed aggression on the high seas or in Palestinian waters by the Israeli regime against unarmed vessels”.

The British government has loudly pledged Royal Navy help to stop the “smuggling” of arms to the Gaza resistance but won’t protect Gaza’s fishermen from being fired on by Israeli marauders while trying to earn their living. And evidently the government can’t be bothered to protect our own people going about their lawful business.

But, sure enough, they kicked up an almighty fuss when Iran nabbed 15 British sailors two years ago for allegedly straying into Iranian waters.

For our sins we are saddled with a foreign secretary who calls for Israeli tank crewman Gilad Shalit’s release but not the release of 11,000 Palestinian civilians – some of them women and children – rotting in Israeli jails. He even allows the British ambassador to become a dogsbody of the Jewish community in this one-sided campaign. On 25 June Miliband said: ‘Today is the third anniversary of the kidnapping of Gilad Shalit. Both British Ministers and the British Ambassador in Israel have had repeated contact with Gilad’s family and emphasized our support for Gilad’s immediate release. Last September, the Ambassador helped to deliver over 2,000 Jewish New Year cards for Gilad to the ICRC as part of a campaign organized by the UK Jewish community. I repeat the UK’s call to Hamas for his immediate, unconditional, and safe release. We share the Shalit family’s dismay at Hamas’s refusal to allow the ICRC access to Gilad.

It’s shameful that his dismay doesn’t extend to the 11,000 Palestinian families.

British people are waking up to the truth about Israel’s lawlessness. In the absence of firm action from the British government they are taking reprisals of their own, in the form of boycotts, which has driven Mr Miliband to complain that “the Government is dismayed that motions calling for boycotts of Israel are being discussed at trade union congresses and conferences this summer”. He insists that boycotts “obstruct opportunities for co-operation and dialogue and serve only to polarise debate further. Boycotts would only make it harder to achieve the peace that both Palestinians and Israelis deserve and desire”.

Mr Miliband hasn’t learned the lesson of the last 61 years. And our prime minister-in-waiting, David Cameron (a Zionist and, like Brown and Blair, a patron of the Jewish National Fund), is no different. He says: “I think there’s something else we need to do, which is to say to our academics in this country that boycotts of Israel are completely unacceptable, and I think we also need to say that to the trade unions.”

Nowadays you have to carefully to pick your way through a veritable obstacle-course of pro-Zionists, Chosen Ones and Israeli stooges that inhabit every nook and cranny in the corridors of power and dominate Britain’s key defence bodies. These Israeli flag-wavers seem only too happy for the Israelis to piss on us – and on the rest of the world – while rewarding them with more and more trade and scientific co-operation.

Stuart Littlewood, after working on jet fighters in the RAF, became an industrial marketeer in oil, electronics and manufacturing, and with innovation and product development consultancies. He also served as a Cambridgeshire county councillor and a member of the Police Authority. He is an Associate of the Royal Photographic Society and has produced two photo-documentary books including Radio Free Palestine (with foreword by Jeff Halper). Now retired, he campaigns on various issues, especially the Palestinians' struggle for freedom. Read other articles by Stuart, or visit Stuart's website.

99 comments on this article so far ...

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  1. Michael Kenny said on July 4th, 2009 at 10:47am #

    The wonderful thing about all of this is that the Israelis are painting themselves into the same impossible corner as the European Jews painted themselves into in pre-WWI Europe. They bought power and influence from the local bully and then trampled the little people underfoot. In 1918, the bullies collapsed. As Napoleon said of the French aristocracy, they have learned nothing and forgotten nothing.

  2. catherine said on July 4th, 2009 at 11:33am #

    Thanks for this.

    Truly, I don’t know what to do at this point. Is there no level to which Israel won’t sink, and that the international community (leaders, not real people) won’t countenance?

    Well, I guess you could ask the survivors of the attack on the Liberty, 42 years ago.

    By the way, am very proud of all the UK/European success in BDS actions.

  3. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 4th, 2009 at 12:14pm #

    folks, israelis have a country and palestinians have a county. The aggression of ’67 was waged to ensure that palestine never rises.
    of course, US must have approved of the aggression and the total destruction of palestine.

    we do not know whether some european lands were also for the ’67 aggression against arab lands.
    what, methinks, 99% to 99.99% of ‘jews’ fear, is that US will not any time soon allow expulsion of palestinians from all of ex-palestina.
    it may one day. It wld depend on several factors: taming of afpak, iraq, and how fast the oil is depleted.

    some of the ‘jews’ are frantic about the fact that there are still palestin ians in ex-palestine and that US permits it.
    that may be because they don’t know what really is going on and what the plan is. tnx

  4. B99 said on July 4th, 2009 at 12:44pm #

    So former congresswoman Cynthia McKinney is (last I heard) in an Israeli prison. Have you heard this on our corporate news? I haven’t. Imagine if Iran arrested a former member of congress for being somewhere in the Persian Gulf. We would finally get off the Michael Jackson (OK, now Sarah Palin) show and onto around the clock diatribes about bombing Iran.

    PS. I once met Caoimhe Butterly. She does good work. Amazing language Irish is – Caoimhe is pronounced Kwee-va. (mh in Irish is usually pronounced as an English ‘v’ – but not always.)

  5. Jerry D. Rose said on July 4th, 2009 at 12:58pm #

    B99: no sir, you haven’t heard of the current Israeli atrocity against McKinney and the other passengers on Humanity in our “corporate news,” which basically reports only the news of the corporate White House, which has not followed standard diplomatic practice in DEMANDING the release of an American citizen (McKinney) from kidnapping by a foreign power. Obama/Clinton hath not spoken, so what “news” is for them to print?

  6. Ulf, Berlin said on July 4th, 2009 at 2:51pm #

    It’s a great pity that Israelis didn’t bomb this boat with its stupid crew: some 20 idiots less. I hope that Mr. Littlewood will join the next expedition from Cyprus to Gaza, and that this time there will be a sudden accident in the midst of the Mediterranean. Ups!

  7. Max Shields said on July 4th, 2009 at 3:41pm #

    Yes, B99, you are correct. Cynthia McKinney (who I referenced as a post elsewhere) has not even been mentioned. Where is Obama when a former Congressional leader and POTUS candidate is imprisoned traveling in international waters!?

    Obama is worst thing to happen. The Dems who would have been all over this if it was Bush; all over it if it was Bush escalting the war in AFPAK, continuing to occupy Iraq; destablizing Iran, training forces to overthrow the Honduran President; continuing to play cat and mouse with GITMO, with Rendition and Torture, with the environment clean coal and nuke subsidization…with empire and endless war….


  8. Ismail Zayid said on July 4th, 2009 at 4:04pm #

    There is nothing new in this. Israel has practiced not only repeated acts of piracy but has attacked sea vessels, not only of international listings but also vessels of its closest allies, the USA. The example of the attack on the US Liberty. on June 8, 1967, killing 34 US Navy persons and injuring tens of them, remains as a clear example of Israeli fefiance of international law.

  9. Deadbeat said on July 4th, 2009 at 4:32pm #

    Obama is worst thing to happen. The Dems who would have been all over this if it was Bush;

    That may be true IF we were talking about any other country. But we’re talking about ISRAEL here. Both the Dems & Repubs are in lock step agreement when it comes to Israel.

  10. Max Shields said on July 4th, 2009 at 7:12pm #

    “That may be true IF we were talking about any other country. But we’re talking about ISRAEL here. Both the Dems & Repubs are in lock step agreement when it comes to Israel.”

    And where’s the Dem progressives with regard to Hondas and Iraq and AFPAK…I think we still got “lock step”.

    What we need is brother Cornell West to tell us about brother Obama. Or as he prefers Fredrick Douglas West/Abe Lincoln Obama.

    It’s that dumbass talk that gives one the dryheaves. You hear brother West on Israel? Peace and understanding from the good bro.

    Give me a break this is beyond Dem/Repub it’s about fu)ckn elitist shitheads.

  11. Shabnam said on July 4th, 2009 at 8:02pm #

    Former U.S. Congresswoman speaks out of her jail in Israel
    The Palestine Telegraph, Saturday, 04 July 2009
    Palestine, July 4, 2009 (Pal Telegraph) – This is Cynthia McKinney and I’m speaking from an Israeli prison cellblock in Ramle. [I am one of] the Free Gaza 21, human rights activists currently imprisoned for trying to take medical supplies to Gaza, building supplies – and even crayons for children, I had a suitcase full of crayons for children.
    While we were on our way to Gaza the Israelis threatened to fire on our boat, but we did not turn around. The Israelis high-jacked and arrested us because we wanted to give crayons to the children in Gaza. We have been detained, and we want the people of the world to see how we have been treated just because we wanted to deliver humanitarian assistance to the people of Gaza. At the outbreak of Israel’s Operation ‘Cast Lead’ [in December 2008], I boarded a Free Gaza boat with one day’s notice and tried, as the US representative in a multi-national delegation, to deliver 3 tons of medical supplies to an already besieged and ravaged Gaza.

    During Operation Cast Lead, U.S.-supplied F-16’s rained hellfire on a trapped people. Ethnic cleansing became full scale outright genocide. U.S.-supplied white phosphorus, depleted uranium, robotic technology, DIME weapons, and cluster bombs – new weapons creating injuries never treated before by Jordanian and Norwegian doctors. I was later told by doctors who were there in Gaza during Israel’s onslaught that Gaza had become Israel’s veritable weapons testing laboratory, people used to test and improve the kill ratio of their weapons.
    The world saw Israel’s despicable violence thanks to al-Jazeera Arabic and Press TV that broadcast in English. I saw those broadcasts live and around the clock, not from the USA but from Lebanon, where my first attempt to get into Gaza had ended because the Israeli military rammed the boat I was on in international water … It’s a miracle that I’m even here to write about my second encounter with the Israeli military, again a humanitarian mission aborted by the Israeli military.
    Zionism has surely run out of its last legitimacy if this is what it does to people who believe so deeply in human rights for all that they put their own lives on the line for someone else’s children. Israel is the fullest expression of Zionism, but if Israel fears for its security because Gaza’s children have crayons then not only has Israel lost its last shred of legitimacy, but Israel must be declared a failed state.

    Why Green Party does not publicize her case amongst American People? Why Americans are so passive and do nothing to stop Obama’s war crimes in many Muslim countries? Where is Green Party? While Chomsky and his ilk like Joanne Landy from CPD (Campaign for peace and democracy) are signing petition after petition written against Iran, they have not taken any action in support of McKinney and against Israel. Where is their petition against Israel? Where is the clown, Cornell West who still refusing to criticize the puppet of Zionism, Obama? Shame on Obama and shame on Americans who support someone like Barak Obama who is much worse than Bush because Bush was hated by majority of people and Obama, a slave with star of David around his neck, not only is killing Muslims in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq every single day in large number with support of white people as well as color people but also has moved into Somalia and other countries in Africa to kill more Black people using his skin to silent the ‘progressive’ fools including people like Cornell West, a clown. He was selected by his superiors, the Zionists, for his black skin, since America has no credibility and is hated in majority of countries around the world including Muslim countries, in addition to being obedient to power to be a ‘member’ of the corrupt elite. He does anything including bending in front of a fascist and a Zionist puppet like ‘king’ of Saudi Arabia to receive financial aid to slow down collapse of a corrupt and broken financial and political system is based on war economy, militarism, rape and torture, secret prisons all over the world, imprisonment of more than 2 million Americans where majority of them are people of color.
    American people must rise and bring down this corrupt system with its servants as soon as possible to help themselves and billions more around the world.

  12. Max Shields said on July 4th, 2009 at 8:18pm #

    Yes, Shabnam, I use Cornell West as a symbol of the elitist rot goes from African American elitists to white elitists.

    The double talking rhyming simon whose tongue wags faster than his mind, West, has not one word for Cynthia McKinney. McKinney is DOING something. What the hell does this tongue wagging West do…PREACH!!


    As you say, Shabnam, Bush was hated…but Obama is enforcing all of Bush’s policies and he’s lauded; as people like McKinney are locked away by the unholiest of regimes – Israel.

  13. Shabnam said on July 4th, 2009 at 9:14pm #


    You are right. The corporate America knew no one can fool the ‘progressive’ better than Obama, an obedient black man. I am glad there are people like Glen Ford who speaks out against Obama while Cornell West, a clown, continues his acting as a ‘progressive’ and withholding his critics of ‘brother’ Obama not to bring out his weaknesses. No one can hold the influence of Zionism responsible for his lack of leadership because he was familiar with the system. It is obvious that he is not a leader but a follower. Obama knew how the system works, thus, he followed the line and watched carefully not to cross the red lines to get to the WH to become a member of the corrupt elite. This was his intension not to serve anyone but himself.
    Glen Ford is correct and shares my fear that OBAMA IS AN IMMEDIATE THREAT TO AFRICA as well as the Middle East and the Central Asia. The following video shows Glen Ford giving a talk on Barack Obama’s selection to the throne.

  14. Deadbeat said on July 4th, 2009 at 9:45pm #

    It’s that dumbass talk that gives one the dryheaves. You hear brother West on Israel? Peace and understanding from the good bro.

    Max it was you who stated the following…

    Obama is worst thing to happen. The Dems who would have been all over this if it was Bush;

    I disagree. If you re-call the Dems was in lock step with Bush on Iraq and other matters pertaining to the Middle East. Some progressive Democrats spoke out against Bush invasion of Haiti. However wherever Israel and Zionism are involved the Dems and the Repubs are in lock step.

    As far as West he too keeps his mouth shut regarding Zionism. His attempts at reach common ground with Michael Lerner (a liberal Zionist) as a proxy for reaching common ground with Jews was pathetic and a joke. There was an excellent of West regarding the Middle East and Israel on Swan in April or May.


    Once again Max your frustration is a reflection of your DENIAL of Zionism’s influence of the American political economy. Blame Obama all you want but it won’t do a damn thing to confront Zionism as a political and racist ideology.

    The Green Party’s silence as Shabnam notes is much more revealing than Obama’s silence. I’d would naturally expect Obama and Cornel West to be silent. But remember the Green Party offered itself as the “alternative” to the Democrats. I guess in the end they are just the same.

  15. Noisy Tappet said on July 5th, 2009 at 12:01am #

    Interesting to hear your ‘take’ on it in the States. Here in the UK it was mainly women who gots the hots for Obama. He left most of us menfolk cold, although the majority were prepared to give him a chance. Now he’s run out of that initial goodwill.

    The real battlefield, I think, is here at home. We need to undermine Zionism in our midst, take the piss, lampoon it, in order to rob Israel of its ‘western comfort’. The first problem is that all three parties have their Friends of Israel group. In the case of the Conservatives – the next government in all probability – the FoI is particularly strong and Call-Me-Dave Cameron has publicly declared himself a Zionist. What a prat! An effort has to be made at the upcoming general election to ‘out’ these dangerous loonies. Any suggestions on how to do this are welcome

  16. Kafir Harby said on July 5th, 2009 at 4:19am #

    The mercy ship? Spirit of Humanity? Heading for Gaza? Helping out these savages? What a joke. Appeasing the crocodile yes… The arabs of Gaza – many of them really innocent and ignorant – are enslaved by a gang of thugs who call themselves Hamas. They have to be destroyed without hesitation. The leftist fascists in the West should stop giving them any recognition. Not the zionists, not the jews, not the IDF, but the global jihad is the problem. Everywhere in the world. And the source of jihad is islam. Draw your conclusion.

  17. Max Shields said on July 5th, 2009 at 7:29am #


    So what your saying, is that Obama is simply a puppet of the Zionist. That Zionist inform him of his policies particularly economic and foreign and he would be entirely different president if not for Zionism (perhaps he wouldn’t even be the president). And you would add (correct me if I’m wrong) that there is no US empire, what once was ended when Zionists took over the US government to ensure Israel’s continued destruction of Palestinian existence. Following this reasoning, DB – your reasoning – corporate ownership of our political process is really a manifestation of Zionism. That Corporate charters were devised and implemented by the Zionist movement. That all US interventions, certainly since Zionism became predominate, have all been the doing of Zionism. These activities are in Israel’s interests and not US hegemony.

    All else is irrelevant. The President we call Obama is just a Manchurian candidate, now president, with no real personal clue about policy or particular preferences since these are all decided by Zionists.

    And the Green Party is also a Zionist pawn. Perhaps?

    Interesting worldview, DB.

  18. B99 said on July 5th, 2009 at 8:53am #

    Obama is not quite a puppet of the Zionists – but Obama knows (and owes) that he would not be where he is today if he ran counter (or even something far short of perpendicular) to well-placed pro-Israel Jews in the US. As one must get the silent nod of chambers-of-congress to mount a remotely winnable campaign for even minor office in this country (so that one will not be brushed with the taint of being anti-business and anti-American) one must also – above an uncertain level – have the assent of AIPAC (to the extent that questionnaires must be filled out by candidates as to their views on Israel and if ‘wrong’ will be corrected accordingly). Obama had the support of important Jewish-American politicos in Illinois early in his eventual rise to the US senate. (Cynthia McKinney ran afoul of these very forces and found herself booted out of office twice – the second time likely forever. Zionists everywhere relish the thought of McKinney in an Israeli prison.)

    The US -Israel relationship is geopolitically a unique one. Israel has enormous influence (actually control) over both houses of congress on issues Israel cares about, which in turn makes it very difficult for any president (and the entire executive body including the State Dept) to exercise an independent policy. Not that presidents are predisposed to differentiate themselves on Israel – they too came up through the system. The major countervailing influence are the powerful and wealthy Middle East states that also lean on the US and from which the all-important petroleum resources are obtained. Thus the US must play ball with leaders in those nations and does so to the tremendous detriment of their populations. However, Israel’s influence over US policy-makers is far greater than that of Arab/Muslim leaders to the extent that US policy in the region is a hodge-podge of initiatives varying from bad to heinous. Of course, punishing wayward Muslim nations is not only about control of energy resources but is at the behest of Israel which is delighted to see the US alter the facts on Middle East ground – the fruition of Israeli policy efforts in the US.
    Obama’s natural instincts are in the abstract, pro-self determination for all peoples. He may have met his match in Netanyahu though, and settlements in Occupied Palestine continue to expand in number and size and population. Does Obama want to tempt fate and risk an all-points attack on his foreign policy (and his very being, politically and possibly physically) if he were to actually back his expressed druthers with policy measures to curtail Israel? I doubt it. I am certain that pro-Israel operatives are already advising congress members of both parties as to where they must take a stand.
    As to the Green Party USA, if they issued a memorandum regarding McKinney or the pirated boat, would anyone read it or listen? Especially between elections, the Green Party is a non-factor in national/international politics. And while the Green Party is certainly not a zionist pawn, there are always those among its members who want to see criticism of Israel muted. Sometimes this manifests itself in obfuscation, sometimes in diversion of Green attention towards issues more ‘environmental,’ and sometimes in silence – which may be the present case.

  19. Max Shields said on July 5th, 2009 at 9:15am #


    There is no bigger speculated false argument than: “Obama’s natural instincts are in the abstract, pro-self determination for all peoples.”

    Everything you’ve written above gives the lie to this assertion.

  20. David said on July 5th, 2009 at 9:41am #

    Here’s a little hint as to why so many governments cave in to the disgusting crap that the Israelis have been dishing out for so long:

    Suitcase nukes in carefully selected Israeli foreign embassies.

    Have a nice day, folks.

  21. Shabnam said on July 5th, 2009 at 11:10am #

    “Obama’s natural instincts are in the abstract, pro-self determination for all peoples.”

    He means Obama is with Israel’s plan to partition the regional countries to help Israel to establish “greater Israel” to create non-Arab states according to Oded Yinon:

    1) Act as a regional empire
    2) To partition regional states through destabilization process

    That’s why he has intensified his attack on Afghanistan, Pakistan and speed up the destabilization plan in Iran directed by the Zionist lobby and has involved African countries such as Sudan, Somalia and Zimbabwe in his empire building with Black face leaving his ‘progressive’ supporters unmoved with unspoken, behind.
    It is American’s duty to rise up and topple Obama and his Zionist administration controlled by zionist lobby in form of political and economic advisors before is too late. Obama is worse than Bush.

    All African-Americans must understand that HE IS AN IMMEDIATE THREAT TO AFRICA AS WELL AS MIDDLE EAST AND CENTRAL ASIA. He is pushing the Zionist interest where has become American interest incorrectly by the 5th columnists, the Zionist Lobby. His policies is harmful to billions of people, including Americans, all over the world.

  22. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 5th, 2009 at 11:54am #

    98% of americans support expansion of israel. Possibly 99.99% of ‘jews’ want even a ‘jewish’ state that wld not only include all of palestine but golan and shebaa farms.
    probably 98-99% of the christo-judean adherents likewise want a jewish state in all of palestine +.
    there is over one bn of christians in the world and about 15 mn ‘jews’.
    so ‘jews’ represent just about 01 or 02% of the zionists.
    so, the question arises, do that many ‘jewish zionists’ control not only US but all the other christian lands?
    and if so, why don’t the ‘jewish zionists’ have a ‘jewish state’ yet and appear mad/sad about the fact that they don’t have a state of their own in all of palestine?
    hello ‘jews’ , who is in control? tnx

  23. B99 said on July 5th, 2009 at 12:35pm #

    Max – No, I think much of Obama’s life and upbringing have prepared him to have ‘instincts’ of self-determination for all peoples. These instincts are tougher to maintain if one wants to move ahead in politics – eventually, the instincts come up against the real world, the real world as revealed to him by some very strong agents. So he compromises here and abandons there – and even gets on board wish Bush/neo-conservative/neo-liberal policies to save his skin. It all goes against what he learned from Rashid Khalidi and fellow travelers – but now that he is in power he’s up against the exigencies of empire – and who wants to lose an empire?

  24. Deadbeat said on July 5th, 2009 at 12:53pm #

    I made a typo in my previous response. That should have read that there was an excellent critique of Cornel West’s in Swan either this past April or May.

    Max writes …
    So what your saying, is that Obama is simply a puppet of the Zionist. That Zionist inform him of his policies particularly economic and foreign and he would be entirely different president if not for Zionism (perhaps he wouldn’t even be the president). And you would add (correct me if I’m wrong) that there is no US empire, what once was ended when Zionists took over the US government to ensure Israel’s continued destruction of Palestinian existence.

    Once again Max you deliberately misstate my position. I’ll state it again for you Max please read it carefully. Zionism is a racist ideology that has an enormous INFLUENCE upon U.S. Foreign Policy specifically as well as her political economy. There is OVERWHELMING evidence of this fact HOWEVER the Left has spent these past 35 years OBSCURING to the extent of DENYING this fact.

    This DOES NOT preclude that the United States in an empire. The U.S. has always invaded other people lands. It’s history is replete with this. The issue are the INTEREST that pushes the U.S. Government and how to CONFRONT those interest. In other words Zionism is very much a PART of the motivations of U.S. Empire and the Left displays its hypocrisy by DENYING and or obscuring Zionism’s influence upon the U.S. Empire project.

    In other words in order to CONFRONT U.S. Imperialism today you MUST confront Zionism on the homefront. Those on the “Left” who now find it necessary to speak out on Iran (as an example) are SILENT about Zionism at home.

    You are right Max. Obama would NOT be President if he didn’t kowtow to the Zionist Lobby Groups. We saw how ALL THREE candidates — Democrats and Republicans” bowed before AIPAC.

    Because Zionism is a racist ideology it would be very easy to CONFRONT and to MOBILIZED people of color against,. This goes to Shabnam concerns of how Obama triangulates African Americans from Obama’s fronting for Zionist interests. Unfortunately Max you and others like you who’d rather OBSCURE or deny Zionism’s influence WITHIN the U.S. are actually inadvertently (or deliberately) aiding U.S. Imperialism despite claiming the opposite.

    A real confrontation of Zionism means mobilizing people against RACISM and that would be a tremendous united front against Imperialism. Handling Zionism as solely an Israeli issue narrows the scope and focus and actually weakens the effectiveness of such a confrontation. Boycotting Israel is a good first step but it aim is to narrow the focus of Zionism’s influence rather than to hold a mirror to the U.S. itself.

    I hope this clarifies things for you Max and please STOP misrepresenting my position unless your aim is to confuse and to obscure Zionism influence upon the U.S. political economy and its drive to maintain U.S. Imperialism for its gain.

  25. B99 said on July 5th, 2009 at 12:58pm #

    Bozh – I think you made up the figures on support by Americans of expansion of Israel. One of the reasons Israel is able to control US policy is that most American gentiles have no compelling views on the struggle. High percentages favor Israel – or more likely – denigrate the Palestinians, but relatively few have opinions strong enough to voice coherently or act upon. They have ‘no dog in this fight.’ And many cognizant Americans believe both sides are at fault. Jews are of course more cognizant. Still, many Jews in America do not follow the issues daily or find them a drag to think about. Others are reflexively pro-Israel but don’t know much of the specifics – Sheba’a farms means little or nothing to these people. Nonetheless, Jews (relative to others) in America are educationally, financially, and influence-wise, more successful than any other group. They are well-organized, well-motivated, well-positioned and ethnically self-conscious. Given this, it is not surprising they are able to substantially influence US policy in the Middle East. Similar is true to varying, if lesser degrees, of other countries.

    Getting back to US gentiles, there is indeed a strong bend towards Zionism among Christian fundamentalists. Yesterday, one such fellow told me that North Korea must be bombed, Iran must be bombed, and Hezballah and Hamas must be extinguished. He said that the destruction of Israel is in Iran’s charter. When I told him that Israel kills Palestinians at about a 10 to one ratio, he replied that this was not true – Hamas is so foul that they kill their own and blame Israel. So the battle for American hearts and minds may be going the wrong way. Still, lots of Americans now understand that Israel frequently oversteps its bounds.

    Anyway, its a complicated issue – but its not 99.9%. And the Israel-Firsters have largely succeeded in their goals. After all, anyone can see that Israel is no asset to speak of , in that region, they are a distinct liability.

  26. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 5th, 2009 at 2:45pm #

    barry99, thanks for your input
    the numbers are my estimates. However, in last november, 98% of those who cast their votes, voted for one party system- or to be more exact, for two people who may think exactly the same when it comes to US and israel’s expansion.
    in addition, i am of the opinion that all candidates for presidency differed from one another and from all others who ran in the past, only in degree of brutality, and not in kind.
    thus, by extention, amers voted also for israel’s extension.

    that was done while in a thoughtless to a thoughtful manner. I do not mean to imply that; lets say, 90-95% of amers are as gulity as the top five or two % of amers or ‘jews’ .
    if society is hyerarchial in its structure, so shld be guilt be graduated as well as punishement meted for crimes against innocent people slain by the duad.

    i do think that about 99.99% of ‘jews’ wld approve of a ‘jewish’ only state in ex-palestine.
    but even if it is just 90% in favor of a such a state, it wld not make any difference to the ‘final solutions’
    one in decades to come [a big + for ‘jews’] and the other in centuries.[a big + for palestinians]
    after all, palestine had been in wars or warring for at least 5K yrs; so what’s another few centuries? tnx

  27. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 5th, 2009 at 3:19pm #

    there is no doubt that in landrobbing by US, israel is onside. However, question arises, do their interest conflate?
    i think they do. The more US conquers in asia or anywhere else, the more it also suits, i educe, israel and even europe as long they remain much [or completely become] asocial.

    i don’t know that one can elucidate US landgrabbing unless one also ties the expansion of the triad [US, isr/eur] to also eradication of all vestiges of socialism.
    one cannot elucidate US foreign policy unless one also studies religious strife and its influence in ME. And all posters, as far as i know, leave this factor out.
    israel is indeed a major player in the triad but, salient facts prove without shaddow of doubt that it became this much powerful because of US/EUR .
    left on its own 80, 60 yrs ago or at any time, isr cldn’t manufacture a spoon.
    and isr had not ever been of any military import to nato- isr was valauble as tool of the west to further disunite arab world and stoke religious fires.
    here nato had brilliantly succeeded. Most arab lands are also onside. case in point was iraq. Nearly all arab lands turned against iraq.
    in fact in ’91, arab lands joined US in its aggression against iraq.

    this is why i think ruling class in US is so sensitive for israelis; they being cannon fodder for US and european interests.

  28. Max Shields said on July 5th, 2009 at 3:39pm #

    DB, thanks for the clarification. I must say I would not have persisted if you had simply stated what you stated here and now.

    The issue I have is when posters demand EVERYTHING be viewed through the prism of Zionism.

    Today, on network tv, Biden claimed the US would not interfer with Israel if it were to use whatever method against Iran.

    He did NOT have to say that. He could have tempered that rather than claiming that a sovereign nation has the “right” to do whatever because it has a “fear”. The world is far too small and there are laws. But the fact that he made such comments was not because a Zionist was telling him to; but because HE (Biden) believes that.

  29. Max Shields said on July 5th, 2009 at 3:49pm #

    btw, thanks for the critique on West. Pretty good.

  30. sid wright said on July 5th, 2009 at 4:42pm #

    it would appear that the saudis and the zionists are now allies

    Saudis give nod to Israeli raid on Iran

    The head of Mossad, Israel’s overseas intelligence service, has assured Benjamin Netanyahu, its prime minister, that Saudi Arabia would turn a blind eye to Israeli jets flying over the kingdom during any future raid on Iran’s nuclear sites.

    Earlier this year Meir Dagan, Mossad’s director since 2002, held secret talks with Saudi officials to discuss the possibility.

    The Israeli press has already carried unconfirmed reports that high-ranking officials, including Ehud Olmert, the former prime minister, held meetings with Saudi colleagues. The reports were denied by Saudi officials.

    “The Saudis have tacitly agreed to the Israeli air force flying through their airspace on a mission which is supposed to be in the common interests of both Israel and Saudi Arabia,” a diplomatic source said last week.

    Although the countries have no formal diplomatic relations, an Israeli defence source confirmed that Mossad maintained “working relations” with the Saudis.

    John Bolton, the former US ambassador to the United Nations who recently visited the Gulf, said it was “entirely logical” for the Israelis to use Saudi airspace.

    Bolton, who has talked to several Arab leaders, added: “None of them would say anything about it publicly but they would certainly acquiesce in an overflight if the Israelis didn’t trumpet it as a big success.”

    Arab states would condemn a raid when they spoke at the UN but would be privately relieved to see the threat of an Iranian bomb removed, he said.

    Referring to the Israeli attack on an alleged Syrian nuclear facility in 2007, Bolton added: “To this day, the Israelis haven’t admitted the specifics but there’s one less nuclear facility in Syria . . .”

    Recent developments have underscored concerns among moderate Sunni Arab states about the stability of the repressive Shi’ite regime in Tehran and have increased fears that it may emerge as a belligerent nuclear power.

    “The Saudis are very concerned about an Iranian nuclear bomb, even more than the Israelis,” said a former head of research in Israeli intelligence.

    The Israeli air force has been training for a possible attack on Iran’s nuclear site at Natanz in the centre of the country and other locations for four years.

  31. Michael Dawson said on July 5th, 2009 at 5:48pm #

    Shabnam, what anti-Iran treaty did Chomsky sign? Name it.

    Meanwhile, Bozh, you own estimates of U.S. public opinion are both way wrong and take no account of the complete lack of any opportunity for serious measurement of such opinion. What percentage of Americans would tell Israel to get back inside its UN 242 borders and leave Palestine alone, if they knew the facts? I’d wager that number would be at least as strong as the 70 percent majority who say they want government medical insurance, when they get the smallest chance to be asked about it.

    Blaming the population for the crimes of the power elite is a very, very slippery slope.

    As for pissing on Chomsky, that’s simply shooting yourself in the foot. It’s one thing to be outraged. it’s another thing to take your outrage as a license to lie and abandon all perspective.

    Meanwhile, as Arno J. Mayer says, “Without the enormous and practically unconditional financial, military, and diplomatic support of the United States and European Union, Israel would be an unexceptional small Middle Eastern nation-state, not an anomalous regional superpower.” Israel is a U.S. aircraft carrier. Our elite doesn’t give a crap about Zionism or Jews.

  32. Shabnam said on July 5th, 2009 at 6:44pm #

    Mr. Dawson:

    It is not treaty, rather many petitions where can be viewed as anti Iran
    for many Iranians.

    Chomsky has signed all petitions on Iran prepared by Campaign for peace and democracy, CPD, where many Iranians refused to sign because they believed it contained hidden agenda of ‘regime change.’ CPD slogan, Neither imperialist war, Nor theocracy, same as HOPI’ s slogan where cost them to be thrown out of CASMII in Britain for the same reason, generated a lot of anger among Iranians where in turn they sent letters to Joanne Landy, one of the co-editors at CPD, to critic their content of their petition signed by many including Chomsky.
    Furthermore, CPD, has generated many petitions in support of the dissidents including Ramin Jahanbeglou, NED enabler, Shireen Ebadi, a close associate of Payam Akhavan who has established ‘Iran Human Rights Documentation Center ‘ in New Haven in 2004 with two other Iranians, Roya HakKakian and her husband Ramin Ahmadi where this center received more than $1.5 million grant from NED. Akhavan is also a board member of ‘Rights and Democracy’ funded by Canadian government, twin sister of NED in the US. The latest petition signed by Chomsky and others in support of the protesters in Iran after the elections result can be found at the following link:

  33. Deadbeat said on July 6th, 2009 at 2:03am #

    bozh writes…

    this is why i think ruling class in US is so sensitive for israelis; they being cannon fodder for US and european interests.

    Bozh i think there is too much “intellectualizing” going on in your remarks. This is not to disrespect your perspectives. My point is to come up with ideas and solution to MOBILIZE the masses. Even 40 years after the Civil Rights movement racism is a sensitive issue in the U.S. and can be used to MOBILIZE folks. Such a mobilization would be a threat to U.S. Imperialism if that is what is truly to be confronted.

    “Imperialism” can be sold as a “good” thing but racism cannot. I think that a mobilization against Capitalism and Racism can reach the masses and get them mobilized. Mobilization will also strengthen solidarity and will help to educate those who get active about the more complex aspect of Imperialism.

  34. Deadbeat said on July 6th, 2009 at 2:07am #

    Max writes…

    He did NOT have to say that. He could have tempered that rather than claiming that a sovereign nation has the “right” to do whatever because it has a “fear”. The world is far too small and there are laws. But the fact that he made such comments was not because a Zionist was telling him to; but because HE (Biden) believes that.

    But Max recall that Biden identifies himself AS A ZIONIST. That means he has adopted a racist ideology and must be identified by the Left as as the RACIST that he is.

    You see Max over the pass 30 years even the Left has been rather conservative about its own confrontation of racism — especially Zionism. So essentially Max you are incorrect. A Zionist is in fact telling him what to say and that Zionist is JOE BIDEN.

  35. mary said on July 6th, 2009 at 3:38am #

    Sid Wright ref Saudi airspace. The Israelis have denied it but they would wouldn’t they.

    The BBC (ZBC) are reporting Biden sliming around Israel.

    There is another report of an Israeli nuclear sub using the Suez Canal for the first time. They have three of these Dolfin subs, one of which was donated to them by the Germans. There have been reports of the torpede tubes being enlarged on one of them to accomodate nuclear missiles.

    And lastly this extremely sad but powerful video from the Free Gaza movement which Biden, H Clinton, Brown and Obama should be forced to sit down and watch.
    Cry for the prisoners, express your outrage……..

    This video needs to be sent far and wide. There are 11,000 Palestinian prisoners, many without benefit of trial, many in prison for years without being able to see their families. Israel outdoes the U.S. in torture, imprisonment and brutality. Where do you think the U.S. learned how to torture?

    Greta Berlin
    Free Gaza Movement
    357 99 284 102
    PS Heard that Kissinger was at the tennis yesterday watching Federer/Roddick. Isn’t that jolly. Must have made a change for him being in the open air and bright sunlight instead of lurking in his usual murky spaces.

  36. Max Shields said on July 6th, 2009 at 5:34am #

    Because one declares themselves…whatever…a Zionist, does not mean they are being “told”. They (Biden in this case) has, perhaps, embraced Zionism at some level, but he was not “told to”.

    My point was originally addressing B99’s assertion that Obama is under the control, beyond his own “instincts”, of powerful interest groups, primarily pro-Israel Jews/AIPAC.

    I think that’s pure hogwash. Not that presidents are immune to powerful interest groups, but that a President is going against an instinct. The issue is that Obama’s instincts are demonstrated in what he does. His desire for power. His willingness to go along and stock his economic “team” with Wall Street banksters…IS his instinct.

    Letting this fellow off the hook by saying, as his libreral supporters would have it, that he “has to” do certain things in order to do ????? is pure bull.

    Obama wants to go through this presidency with as little difficulty to his personal ambitions as possible. The symbolism of an African-American in the White House is what he offers. He will use that to do what he apparently is good at…being the velvet glove to the brutality that the US continues to wage. The symbolism of Obama will be used to keep this country asleep until the bottom falls out entirely.

  37. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 6th, 2009 at 6:08am #

    if one criticises another on an over-generalized level by using the word “intellectualizing” that characterizes s’mone’s post, then it behooves the critic to provide readers with one or more specific instances that wld in your eyes represent “too much intellectualizing”.
    even so, i wld be ‘intelectualizing’ only perhaps in your mind and possibly in noone else’s.

    in land robbing, by whomever, racism is just one cause in lust for other peoples’ resources.
    land robbing is not part of racism; it is, to me, the other way around.
    there are several causes for land robbing: greed, fear, hatred, supremacism, cults, glory, promotion and may be some others we may yet discover.

    since israel is is about 4th or 5th military might in the world and yet hadn’t been able to oust palestinians to set up coveted ‘jewish’ state in palestine, shows or even proves that the only reason for the ‘failure’ is the probability that US and aipac wld not permit it.
    sorry, DB, this astounding fact, fact that ‘jews’ don’t have a country yet after striving for it for 70 yrs, clashes with your conclusion that some ‘jews’ control US.
    my advise to you, is to stop identifying a conclusion with a fact. You’ll get more peace that way. tnx

  38. Ari said on July 6th, 2009 at 9:07am #

    Wake up people, to an outsider, all your comments sound like you are brainwhashed. You all say the same things, and you completely ignore the basic facts. (1) Gaza is Hamas, an islamic regime, at war with Israel, (2) This is a propaganda boat, come on, open your eyes, the 3 tons of whatever was on the boat is marginal compared to the thousands (!) of tons in dozens of trucks entering Gaza daily (!) from Israel. (3) These activists want you to focus on them, when the real problem, that does not concern them, is how to make the two sides accept to live side by side. You heard me, the TWO sides, there is not only a Zionist (state for the jews) problem, but also a Hamas (exclusive Islamist land) problem. I am Ari_Lux on Twitter.

  39. Harry Canary said on July 6th, 2009 at 9:44am #

    Aer you a paid shill for the Zionist state?

  40. mary said on July 6th, 2009 at 9:45am #

    A new Zionist troll arrives on DV scattering paragraphs containing the entity’s propaganda and lies. Hasbara calling. Hasbara calling…

    PS I thought Lux meant light. Can’t see any being shone here.

  41. Noisy Tappet said on July 6th, 2009 at 11:19am #

    Nobody in their right mind would wish to live side-by-side with Zionists, who lie, cheat, steal and murder as a way of life.

  42. mary said on July 6th, 2009 at 11:59am #

    Mr Atias says Go North and Multiply. A further example of the entity’s attempts to drive the Palestinians completely off their land.

    Jonathan Cook’s article
    Mayors want to stop “Arab takeover”
    By Jonathan Cook in Nazareth

    6 July 2009

    Israel’s housing minister has called for strict segregation between the country’s Jewish and Arab populations last week as he unveiled plans to move large numbers of fundamentalist religious Jews to Israel’s north to prevent what he described as an “Arab takeover” of the region.

    Ariel Atias said he considered it a “national mission” to bring ultra-Orthodox Jews – or Haredim, distinctive for their formal black and white clothing – into Arab areas, and announced that he would also create the north’s first exclusively Haredi town.

    The new settlement drive, according to Mr Atias, is intended to revive previous failed efforts by the state to “Judaise”, or create a Jewish majority in, the country’s heavily Arab north.

    Analysts say the announcement is a disturbing indication that the Haredim, who have traditionally been hostile to Zionism because of their strict reading of the Bible, are rapidly being recruited to the Judaisation project in both Israel and the occupied territories.

    Mr Atias, of the ultra-Orthodox party Shas, is drawing on a model already successfully developed over the past decade in the West Bank, where the Haredim, the group with the highest birth rate in Israel, have been encouraged to move into separate settlements that have rapidly eaten into large chunks of Palestinian territory.


  43. B99 said on July 6th, 2009 at 12:49pm #

    Bozh – There really are two parties in the US. It really does matter on a host of social issues whether the Dems or Reps are in power. That does not mean the Dems are the good party – just that there is enough difference between the two that African-Americans know who to vote for. And of course, very few non-Jews vote on the issue of Palestine/Isrel per se.
    Surveys show that many Jews are willing to see a Palestinian state next to Israel. It’s just that this segment of the Jewish population (soft Zionists) does not have the ‘passionate intensity’ or conviction that the Hard Zionists have. Many Jews would like to see a Palestinian state because it would be best for Jews if there were.

    Michael Dawson – Israel is pretty much a negative as an asset. They get the billions of dollars and UN protection because they demand it. Unlike South Africa, which did not have a large or powerful population base in the US, the Israelis do – they can make and break congressmembers. They put McKinney out of office twice – and are now pleased to retain her behind bars. You are right, of course that our elite (the non-Jews, anyway) largely do not care a wit about Jews or Zionism, but our elites do act in their own best interests.

    Max – Obamas instincts are not reflected in what he does. What he does is real politique. Obama grew up the son of an anthropologist, raised in Hawaii and Indonesia, he did the community organizing thing. There’s a lot there based in a generous view of humanity. As he has moved deeper and higher in politics he finds he must cater to the forces of hegemony and imperialism – or be ridden out of town in the next election. But its not a matter of being under control of powerful interests, its a matter of political survival. He’s not strong enough to beat it back or clever enough to work around it.

    Bozh – You’ve said more than once that Jews don’t have a country. That’s not clear to anyone I’m sure. It’s obvious they have Israel.

  44. Noisy Tappet said on July 6th, 2009 at 12:52pm #

    From Wiki – “Within the next three decades, the Haredi community is predicted (by the Board of Deputies) to be the largest Jewish group in the UK: in comparison with the national average of 2.4 children per family, Haredi families have an average of 5.9 children.”

    Pretty worrying. What crowded country can afford to have this unpleasant lot multiplying like fury?

  45. B99 said on July 6th, 2009 at 1:03pm #

    Ari – 1) Hamas, an Islamic regime (so what), is not at war with Israel – it is defending what’s left of Palestine from siege and occupation by Israel.
    2) Yes, this is a propaganda boat, but GOOD propaganda, the kind used by people who want to open the world’s eyes to Israel’s malignant behavior. 3) It is irrelevant if there is ego involved. Ego is always involved. But there IS an illegal siege and blockade of Gaza, and we all have the right and duty to break that blockade. The way for the two sides to live in peace is for Israel to take its troops and settlers and go home to Israel, and to begin implementing UN 194 as Israel agreed to as a condition of admission to the UN (UN 273) .
    There is no Hamas problem. Hamas gained in power when Israel failed to relinquish one acre of land to Fatah over the course of (now) 45 years – instead violently taking more land with every passing minute. So let’s not pretend Hamas is the problem – Israel is the problem.

  46. Max Shields said on July 6th, 2009 at 1:31pm #

    B99 “Max – Obamas instincts are not reflected in what he does. What he does is real politique. Obama grew up the son of an anthropologist, raised in Hawaii and Indonesia, he did the community organizing thing. There’s a lot there based in a generous view of humanity. As he has moved deeper and higher in politics he finds he must cater to the forces of hegemony and imperialism – or be ridden out of town in the next election. But its not a matter of being under control of powerful interests, its a matter of political survival. He’s not strong enough to beat it back or clever enough to work around it.”

    This is liberal bullshit. Instincts are what you do naturally. What Obama DOES is play politics and he DOES it naturally, instinctively.

    Survival??? What the hell are you talking about? Who the hell put a fuc%king gun to Obama’s head and said “you must run for President; and you must follow the orders of the bankers and powerful pro-Israeli Jews, and bow to AIPAC and kiss my every loving asssssssss”? Who B99.

    You holding the gun at Obama? 3 years as a wet behind the ears “community” organizer. What did he organize? What did he DO? B99. One of his parents was an anthropologist…are you a child B99?

    What does having a parent as an anthropologist got to do with the guy in the White House who’s got us in the 3rd war – Pakistan? And who has continued with the Bush policies?

    Survive? Who cares if this guy survives politically? Do you? Why? Because he’s a phony symbol? He wants nukes and clean coal. Rendition continues as does torture as a general policy under Obama.

    B99 you now have a little Zionist you can play cat and mouse with for the next 2 months.

  47. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 6th, 2009 at 1:48pm #

    i am aware that i have said that ‘jews’ don’t have a country- and i may add, neither de jure nor de facto.
    i say this for new readers and not for regular posters.
    and i have repeated many other facts and conclusions for the same reason.

    actually the key to it all is the constitution- one and the only; written by masters of obnubilation; full of vacuities, and by slave owners; interpreted exactly the same by the two wings of one party. Uncle sam or the constitution allows or may even demand that there be at least semblance of disagreement btwn the two wings.
    disagreementsb twn dems and reps, in any case, are about cosmetics and other minor mattetrs and not on the most basic human rights which i’m not going to enumerate at this time. But thanks for you comment.
    and i am glad you brought up the fact that i say israel does not as yet exist.
    but it is not only blacks who have been duped by uncle; it seems 98% of americans have been led astray. tnx

  48. Deadbeat said on July 6th, 2009 at 3:53pm #

    Max writes…

    This is liberal bullshit. Instincts are what you do naturally. What Obama DOES is play politics and he DOES it naturally, instinctively.

    I agree with Max that is liberal bullshit. Obama has choices. What makes it worse is that he cemented himself in the African American community only to betray its long held ideas and tenets. Obama is in it for Obama and he and his family are going to be richly rewarded.

  49. Michael Dawson said on July 6th, 2009 at 3:54pm #

    B99, you say elites act in their own interests, which is true, of course. But you also call Israel a negative asset and that “they get the billions of dollars and UN protection [simply] because they demand it. ”

    So which is it? Is the US elite getting something valuable to its elite from Israel, or are evil Jews somehow tricking those elites?

    Meanwhile, Shabnam, I did mean petition, not treaty. Chomsky is not allowed within a mile of any high office, of course. My bad!

    Meanwhile, I still think your phrase “Chomsky and his ilk” is off-base. First of all, as he himself says all the time, Chomsky lends his name to many petitions. Do you think he would also lend his name to one denouncing US imperialism against Iran? Of course he has, does, and always would. So, what “ilk” are you trying to manufacture here?

    By the way, while it is certainly Iranians’ right to choose theocracy for themselves if they wish, I personally strongly agree with the concept of “neither imperialism nor theocracy.” I also find your Ayatollah system to be an obvious case of theocracy, with all the attendant repressions and denials of human rights. I absolutely will fight to the best of my ability to keep my government out of your affairs, not least because I know what it did in 1953 and thereafter. But I also don’t like your government, and hope it will become truly open and democratic one day. Two wrongs don’t make a right, and religious states are inherently dangerous.

  50. mebosa ritchie said on July 6th, 2009 at 3:54pm #

    was your brother on this crappy free gaza boat.
    new rules now that olmert has gone
    mess about with israel and your boat gets seized or sunk
    tell your brother to stick to boating on central park
    lots of love

  51. B99 said on July 6th, 2009 at 4:39pm #

    Max – But of course by survival I mean political survival. You’ve heard of that, no? Obama has been and is still finding out how little room he has to maneuver politically. Even Nader would move to the right once in office – capital has a way of exercising its will. To think otherwise is naive.

    I do have to ask if you are still a Green and if so, do you know any Greens nastier than yourself, incapable of conversation without vitriol. For a Green you have the most niggardly attitude re the human spirit I’ve ever encountered. Borders on cretinism.

    After all, I didn’t say anything at all about giving Obama a break, or whether I favor his policies. I’m just saying I think he’s got more favorable roots than say Bush or McCain – but authoritarian capital will have its way.

  52. B99 said on July 6th, 2009 at 4:40pm #

    Bozh – Israel is de jure a nation-state among the world’s nation-states. So I don’t know what you mean.

  53. B99 said on July 6th, 2009 at 4:47pm #

    Obama is definitely in it for Obama – and so is everyone in political office. They don’t go into politics because they hate themselves and want to see themselves fuck up. But so what.

    Obama is pretty much exercising his choices. A few are good, a few are fair to middling, many are bad. But all choices come within the constraints and pressure from powerful interests – none of these interests are citizens at large.

  54. B99 said on July 6th, 2009 at 4:53pm #

    Michael – Political elites don’t want to be thrown out of office so they make sure they cater to the Zionists. That’s in their political interest. That does not mean by any stretch that Israel is an asset to the State of the US, and certainly not the nation of Americans. Israel is a liability in those regards. Just as insurance companies meddling in our health is a liability to most of us (but not the elite who tend to them).

  55. B99 said on July 6th, 2009 at 4:56pm #

    mebosa – clock is ticking on Israel. You can expect many more of your Israeli soulmates to join you in the diaspora for yet another time.

  56. Max Shields said on July 6th, 2009 at 5:09pm #


    You are not reading. I said political survival. You don’t seem to get it and never will from what can be told with your posts.

    You are an Obamabat; I’m NOT. Is that clear?

  57. Noisy Tappet said on July 6th, 2009 at 11:13pm #

    “Mess about with israel and your boat gets seized or sunk
    tell your brother to stick to boating on central park…”

    First, nobody wants to touch Israel or Israelis with a bargepole, they just want to visit the Holy Land which is, or should be, everybody’s (the last official word from the UN was that Jerusalem would be a ‘corpus separatum’ – an international city. Thanks to successive dumb and corrupt US administrations (backed by dumb and corrupt British administrations) it still isn’t.

    Second, so it’s OK for Israel to seize or sink innocent shipping in international waters? Since one of your former Congresswomen was on board the “crappy free gaza boat” and jailed for no good reason (just spite) I’m surprise you’re not biting the carpet, mebosa. What does it take to prod you guys into action of the decent humanitarian kind?

  58. mebosa ritchie said on July 7th, 2009 at 4:25am #

    to nosy tappet

    everyone is free to visit israel including free access to all the holy sites in jerusalem.
    when the un declared jerusalem an international city,the jordanian-palestinians took over the eastern bit and closed off and desecrated jewish and christian holy sites.
    and the un did nothing
    it is only since israel recovered the city in 1967 that the world has had free access to all the holy sites including muslim ones

  59. Noisy Tappet said on July 7th, 2009 at 7:42am #

    “Everyone is free to visit israel including free access to all the holy sites in jerusalem,” says mebosa.

    Utter rubbish. Last time I was there I was blocked three times from the Temple Mount by the IDF. Most Christian Arabs living outside the City are not allowed in to worship in their holy places without special permits, which are difficult to obtain. Even the clergy have obstacles put in their way. Remember that the Old City is actually part of Palestinian East Jerusalem and not Israel.

    When was the last time you were there, mebosa? I suspect you know bugger-all about the situation on the ground.

  60. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 7th, 2009 at 8:16am #

    noisy t,
    mebosa’s job/duty is solely to lead us way from looking and writing about israel’s crimes against humanities. Thus, he dwells only on matters that of peripheral or of no value in elucidating the conflict.

    he, like so many of them, pick on one or two insignifciant events which cannot be proved wrong in order to convey the notion that if one cannot disproove his assertion[s] then one can’t prove israel being wrong. It is a casuistry/sophism/speciouoness of the worst kind.
    i don’t bother to read anything he says any longer.
    i suggest you don’t address or respond to him directly; but merely juxtapose your own facts/conclussion. tnx

  61. Noisy Tappet said on July 7th, 2009 at 8:40am #

    Boz, thanks, I know he’s a troll but he sometimes provides openings…..

  62. mary said on July 7th, 2009 at 9:33am #

    Just in – the latest e-mail from Greta Berlin on the Free Gaza 21 –

    Many of you have been asking us what has happened to the kidnapped passengers and our boat, The SPIRIT OF HUMANITY. Here then is our current update.

    All 21 passengers have now left. Huwaida and Lubna were freed right away, because they hold Israeli citizenship.

    Many passengers did not get all of their belongings back, many computers were stolen, some that were returned had their hard drives completely erased. Many of the pieces of camera equipment were not given back as well, and, of course, none of the tapes of the boarding, roughing up or incarceration of the 21 people who have been returned.

    However, all passengers are already in their country or origin or are returning tonight. The London 6 had a press conference last night, the Bahraini 5 had a press conference in Bahrain over the weekend, and the Irish 2 are being feted tonight with a massive rally at Dublin airport. There will be a big reception and press conference there.

    The two men from Al Jazeera have both been returned to Jordan through the Allenby bridge.

    That leaves the three Americans… Cynthia McKinney, Kathy Sheetz and Adam Shapiro. We hear little from the American media about these three brave passengers, and it will be up to the Americans to express their outrage over their treatment. If they had been kidnapped by the military from Irah or Venezuela, their stories would have been all over the media. Because they were kidnapped by a ‘friendly’ nation, few in the U.S. have opened their mouths.

    As far as Israel is concerned, we will demand that our boat be returned, that our equipment and tapes be returned, and they cease and desist their interference with our human rights trips to Gaza. Because we are going back. Israel can ram our boat, threaten us with bodily harm, shoot at us, board and confiscate the boat, shuttle us off to prison, and we will still return.

    The outrage in many countries over what happened is muted by the fact that 11,000 Palestinians remain in Israeli jails, many without benefit of trial, many languishing for years without being able to see their families.

    And this fact is something we must all remember. We came from countries around the world. We attempted to break Israel’s draconian siege of 1.5 million Palestinians. Even when arrested, the Israelis treated us with kid gloves, afraid of the consequences from governments, activists and human rights organizations. Who will stand up for the Palestinians and do the same thing?

    Please go and watch, if you have not already, our video of our incarceration and the incarceration of Palestinian men, woman and children.

    With grateful thanks from all of us to all of you.

    The Free Gaza Team

  63. mebosa ritchie said on July 7th, 2009 at 10:08am #

    from mebosa the troll—some more openings

    nosy you wrote —- Remember that the Old City is actually part of Palestinian East Jerusalem and not Israel.

    can you please tell which part of palestine israel occupied in 1967.
    who was the palestine prime minister/president in 1967
    what was the palestinian currency in 1967
    what was the capital of palestine in 1967

    i await your answers with interest

  64. mebosa ritchie said on July 7th, 2009 at 10:10am #


    interesting to have someone as erudite as you knowing what’s in my postings considering you don’t read them.
    do you only read the stuff you agree with?
    it’s your choice

  65. Noisy Tappet said on July 7th, 2009 at 11:29am #

    This is not a quiz show, mebosa. I’m sure you could look those things up for yourself if you’re desperate to know.

  66. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 7th, 2009 at 12:55pm #

    michael d,
    sorry about the dealy in responding to you. I s’mhow missed your post about me being wrong about % of USans who, imo, approbate a ‘jewish’ state in all of palestine.
    in last nov. 98% percent of the people voted for the expanding israel. So, i go from what is and not what wld be if amers wld be properly informed.
    i have stated numerous times that amers may be more disinformed than any other nation. And i am always aware of that when meting out guilt for US and israel’s landgrabbings.
    fact is fact and wishful thinking and facts never ever meet. tnx

  67. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 7th, 2009 at 1:17pm #

    israel indeed is legally recognized country in its pre-67 borders. However, neither US nor much of europe, or israel recognize the legal Israel.
    if europe had not abrogated its recognition of israel of ’47, the present expansion of israel wld by all norms of normal and legal internat’l behavior constitute casus belli not only to some 100+ countries but also to europe.

    recall that europe went to war against n. korea[ which merely tried to reunite the two koreas] and thus interfered in a civil war.
    it was able to do that solely because UN in ’50 was largely composed of antisocialist or fascist lands.
    and even by all normal reasoning reunifacation of koreas by war was not in any way worse than reunification of america in the 1860s.
    btw, is not UN now obligated by law at least to impose sanction on israel?
    or even wage war against it? But cannot because that wld be suicidal? hope this elucidates the sit’n. tnx

  68. Mulga Mumblebrain said on July 8th, 2009 at 12:27am #

    Ari the arse-hole is at it again, excreting Zionist racist lies, that imply some false equivalence between the victims and their tormentors, as if there was an equivalence between the Nazis and the occupants of the Warsaw ghetto. And mebosa emerges from ‘neath her rock too, with the usual disinformation. Let’s face it-those who assert moral equivalence, if not superiority, to a brutal, racist, state and its powerless victims are wicked bastards. They have proliferated like toadstools, incited by their delusions of racial supremacism and their unquenchable sadism, to regale us with lies and false assertions, to support brutal child-murderers. And Mr Littlewood neglects to mention the most salient fact concerning the despicable Milliband, ie that he is a Jew, and obviously, I would say from the evidence so far, a vicious Zionist one. Any creature that demands the release of the Jewish prisoner of war, Shalit, while absolutely ignoring the thousands of Palestinians, all illegally detained, nearly all tortured, some kept in secret gaols away from even Red Cross scrutiny, is, in my opinion, a vicious, racist, hypocrite. When nasty types like this run the Western powers, Zionist control cannot be doubted. I do hope DV runs the excellent piece by Diana Johnstone concerning the rampages of Judaic fascists in France, with the whole litany of vile, cowardly, attacks almost totally repressed by the media sewer, and ignored by the police,while every so-called ‘anti-Semitic’ incident is blown up out of all proportion. Just how long will we continue to allow the very worst elements of one tiny tribe to totally dominate our societies, control our media and treat our political masters as chattels at their beck and call?

  69. Mulga Mumblebrain said on July 8th, 2009 at 3:04am #

    Actually, upon reflection, I must apologise for my comparison of Ari to an ‘arse-hole’. It is, indeed, puerile abuse, for which I can only claim in self-exculpation that Zionasties, with their arrogant contempt for their victims and decent opinion, really piss me off. And it is an insult to arse-holes.

  70. mary said on July 8th, 2009 at 3:11am #

    More but this time is prison is closed to those trying to leave with the collusion of Egypt.

    Action alert for Jenny and Natalie – “You will never leave Gaza”

    Jenny and Natalie, both British passport holders, and both long term human rights workers in the Gaza strip, are being prevented from leaving Gaza via the Rafah Crossing. Please take action on their behalf.

    Jenny Linnell is a co-founder of the ISM Rafah group, and an original crew member of one of the “Free Gaza” boats. For the last year she has been accompanying Palestinians and documenting events in the Gaza strip, both before, during and after the war. You can see footage of her work with fishermen and farmers under fire at

    Natalie, from Lebanon (but with a British passport) also entered Gaza via one of the Free Gaza boats and has been working as part of the International Solidarity movement within Gaza since November 2008. You can see her work at
    Since the end of May Jenny has been trying to leave and return home via the border crossing at Rafah into Egypt. She keeps getting turned away, most recently under pretty extreme circumstances, as outlined below. Natalie also needs to leave Gaza in order to take up her place at a British University. The Egyptian Border Guards told both women that they were being refused exit because of their work with the Free Gaza boats. They were told that they would ‘never be let out’.

    Natalie has written an account of their treatment, and their inhuman treatment of so many Palestinians at the Rafah crossing, in ‘The Gates of Hell’
    (June 30th post)
    For the sake of both women and other peace workers it is vital that this treatment is not allowed to continue unchallenged. Please help us get them back by ringing the British Foreign office and the Egyptian Embassy in London.

    The Egyptian Embassy in London
    phone 020 7499 3304/2401
    Fax: +44 (0)20 7491 1542
    The British Foreign Office
    Middle East Desk
    Tel: +44 (0)20 70088784
    Email: jill.bayl… and trish.wi…

    Or the Consular team: phone the Foreign office on +44 (0)2070081500 and ask to be put through to the Consular Assistance team, ( who are there to assist British travellers when abroad).

    If you get a chance to mail me to let me know when you rang, and how it went, it would be great for helping us keep tabs on how effectively the mobilising going. Many many thanks on behalf of Jenny, Natalie and their friends and family.
    Liz Snook. lizthesnook at
    (UK support team for Jenny and Natalie)

    Everybody will be most pleased to know that Cpt Shalit is alive and well in Gaza.
    Nauseating photo here of Peres and Mubarak.

  71. mebosa ritchie said on July 8th, 2009 at 10:35am #

    mugla–more stuff to really piss you off

    The natural gas reserve discovered off the shores of Haifa is approximately 25 to 30 percent richer than previously assessed, US oil operator Noble Energy Inc., said after drilling to verify the find.

    The site, previously assessed to hold more than 142 billion cubic meters (BCM) of natural gas, may in fact hold as much as 180 BCM.

    The potential revenue from selling gas from the offshore reserve may reach $30-35 billion.

    At the end of April, drilling to verify the size of the reserve was conducted at a site dubbed Tamar 2, north of Tamar 1. Over the last few days, electronic testing suggested that the amounts of gas at the Tamar reserve were higher than initially expected.

    In related news, a site called Dalit, west of the coast of Hadera, was assessed to hold some 14 BCM of natural gas.

  72. dan e said on July 8th, 2009 at 4:32pm #

    The Transparent Cabal: The Neoconservative Agenda, War in the Middle East, and the National Interest of Israel
    by Stephen J. Sniegoski
    Hardcover Price: $18.45, 35 used & new from $15.00 on Amazon

    reader review ” This is The One”, March 8, 2009:

    “This is the “one book” anyone must read if he/she wants to understand in depth the mess we are in in the Middle East. Sniegoski explains with documentation from the sources (he has a Ph.d in history, so he knows how to document) how we got drawn into the disaster in Iraq and are now being urged by the SAME PEOPLE to attack Iran. No shame here.

    Yes, our involvement there is all about Israel’s security. No, criticism of our involvement in the Middle East has nothing to do with anti-Semitism, unless you equate criticism of Israel with anti-Semitism . . ..

    Opposite the first page of Chapter 1 is a long quote from the Farewell Address George Washington gave in 1796. It’s spooky to see how prescient he was, and how we have violated every admonition he made about getting involved in somebody else’s fight. Just plug the United States and Israel into the address, and you’ll see what he meant.”

  73. Shabnam said on July 8th, 2009 at 7:16pm #

    Are neocons going to invade Haifa to get control over the natural gas resource, according to closet zionists’ theory behind Iraq war, or they will send more $, instead, to help the zionists to ‘expand’ their settlements on Palestinian land ? This is a good question to ask from Zmag crowd, the ‘left’ hand of Obama’s administration helping the zionist/imperialist’s agenda in the region.

  74. Shabnam said on July 8th, 2009 at 7:46pm #

    [Stephen J. Sniegoski makes some compelling arguments about neoconservatives: (1) they were the driving force behind the Bush administrations war in Iraq, (2) their motivation was based on their belief that American interests in the Middle East are virtually identical with the Israeli Likud partys beliefs about Israeli interests in the region, and (3) these mutual interests lie in destabilizing Israels adversaries and reconfi guring the environment rather than in the traditional American policy of stabilizing the Middle East.]

    Did I not say exactly the same thing for the past fu**ing 2 years on this website?

  75. Deadbeat said on July 9th, 2009 at 3:36am #

    Yes Shabnam you have as well as I have stated that the “Left” has promoted the “War for Oil” canard to obfuscate the role that these Zionist Neo-Cons (which really is a repetition since Neo-conservatism is grounded in Zionism). The Left has aided and abetted the growing influence of Zionism within the U.S.

    One of the main reason why the U.S. will have difficulty changing course is that the Left has shown itself not to be trusted and thus solidarity is extremely weak.

  76. kalidas said on July 9th, 2009 at 7:33am #

    As a friend of mine stated recently…. “the ultimate act of anti-semitism is to stay out of debt.”

  77. dan e said on July 9th, 2009 at 12:09pm #

    Zionists may claim to be Leftists but they aren’t. Isn’t Jas Petras a longtime leftist? Jeff Blankfort? Lenni Brenner? etc etc. Careless use of label “Leftist” conflates friends and allies with enemies. If novice anti-Zionists assume that “Left” equals BAD, they will be deprived of the chance to make use of tools needed to accurately assess the situation & terrain, and instead will be forced to embrace crackpots like Ron Paul and Henry George fans.

    Zunes and Chomsky are not leftists, they’re Liberal Zionists.

  78. KL5 said on July 9th, 2009 at 12:48pm #

    “Zunes and Chomsky are not leftists, they’re Liberal Zionists.”
    To mention that Zunes and Chomsky are not leftists is as superfluous as mentioning that Margaret Thatcher was not a socialist.

    “ Carelsess use of label “Leftist” “
    What is a genuine Leftist?

  79. Deadbeat said on July 9th, 2009 at 1:10pm #

    What is a genuine Leftist?

    Someone genuinely on the Left stands for Justice, Eqaulity, social & economic democracy. To give benign support to a racist ideology which is what Noam Chomsky does is not leftist. Unfortunately Chomsky is held up as being the “most radical” intellectual. Clearly Chomsky’s critiques about “U.S. Imperialism” has been an introduction to the many horrible aspects of U.S. policy but what Chomsky avoids is the growing influence that Zionism has on driving U.S. Imperialism today.

    It is also dishonest and hypocrisy to misinform the public or give the public the impression that the War on Iraq solely a resource war. It was not. It was a war that PREDOMINATELY advanced Zionist interests. Thus this begs the question of taking a closer look at analyzing the behavior of the why the “Left” is denying the obvious and why the “Left” is aiding and abetting U.S. Imperialism rather than confront it.

    Since Zionism is a racist ideology and the ideals behind the Civil Right Movement has altered how the public respond to racism the Left could leverage this aspect of U.S. society to mobilize people (especially people of color) against Zionism and thereby confront a major pillar of U.S. Imperialism. Unfortunately with the ‘Left” obscuring Zionism to outright denying Zionism these past 30 – 35 years and most recently the “Left” behavior to downright discombobulating the anti-war movement we can see that protecting Zionism rather than confronting Zionism has been the “Left’s” agenda and is a major reason why the level of mobilization and solidarity is so weak and retarded on the Left.

  80. Deadbeat said on July 9th, 2009 at 1:17pm #

    Dan E writes…
    If novice anti-Zionists assume that “Left” equals BAD, they will be deprived of the chance to make use of tools …

    I guess that is a valid point. Unfortunately these “Liberal Zionists” are identified as the Left and they have badly weaken the Left.

  81. Deadbeat said on July 9th, 2009 at 1:27pm #

    From James Petras latest article…

    The propaganda success of the US-orchestrated destabilization campaign even found an echo among broad sections of what passes for the US ‘left’ who ignored the massive, coordinated US financing of key Iranian groups and politicos engaged in the street protests. Neo-conservative, liberal and itinerant leftist ‘free-lance journalists’, like Reese Erlich, defended the destabilization effort from their own particular vantage point as ‘a popular democratic movement against electoral fraud.’

    He too uses Left in quotes.

  82. KL5 said on July 9th, 2009 at 1:37pm #


    Thank you for the explanation. I have no doubt that Chomsky is a Zionist and Zionists in the U.S. know about that. Had he not been a Zionist, he would have lost his tenure as a professor of linguistics years ago. But his political thinking has never interested me.

    In my opinion Zionism is a part of a whole, namely U.S. Imperialism. I allow myself to remind you that the world is much larger than Israel and the Middle East. I am Against overzionizing the U.S. foreign policy. Thank you again.

  83. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 9th, 2009 at 2:43pm #

    a leftist to me is a person who demands that everone obtains healthcare and free higher education.
    s/he’s also for the right to be informed; which means that no private person can own knowledge which wld ensure that we all obtain also information and not disinformation.

    a leftist cannot be land robber. S/he wld condemn wars on a principle and not on a rationalization, ‘explanations’, or expediency.
    Chomsky approbates land robbery by israel but probably not land robbing by US.

  84. Michael Dawson said on July 9th, 2009 at 3:24pm #

    I wasn’t aware that Israel policy was up for any kind of debate in the last election, Bozh. How do you imagine that it was?

    As for Chomsky being a Zionism, that’s just willful ignorance, if not slander.

    If you want the truth, watch this lecture, in which Chomsky calls Zionism a bad idea:

  85. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 9th, 2009 at 5:02pm #

    michale d,
    voting for either obama or mccain gives political capital t0 either candidate or long-standing US foreign policy.
    voting for nader was a vote against long-standing US policy of expansionism as well as for own inheritance: healthcare, right to be informed, etc.
    in fact, 98% of amers just last nov. disinherited selves of those two sane basic human rights.

    chomsky is for one state nonsolution. Recognition of israel [which does not as yet exist] amounts to rewarding enormous irgun, stern, and haganah crimes against humanities with a state.
    i cannot an will never approbate those crimes. Nor will i ever approbate crimes of european evil empires for making those crimes possible.
    further more chomsky shld hang his head in shame by urging amers to vote for “lesser evil”.
    which is becoming greater evil as i have predicted prior to O’s selection.
    It amounted to telling people not to vote for healthcare, free education, and the right to be informed.
    which means he is also afascist in addition to being a zionist. tnx
    caveat: u get only one more personal attack; thereafter, i do not read anything u write. And, that’s not a political promise!!

  86. Deadbeat said on July 9th, 2009 at 8:44pm #

    KL5 writes …

    In my opinion Zionism is a part of a whole, namely U.S. Imperialism. I allow myself to remind you that the world is much larger than Israel and the Middle East. I am Against overzionizing the U.S. foreign policy. Thank you again.

    The problem has NOT been the “overzionizing” but the UNDER-zionizing to outright deny any Zionism’s influence of U.S. politics

  87. mary said on July 10th, 2009 at 3:27am #

    As Bozh says – Recognition of israel [which does not as yet exist] amounts to rewarding enormous irgun, stern, and haganah crimes against humanities with a state.

    Quite. And the gangs that perpetrated those crimes were the forerunners of today’s IDF as a friend has said.

  88. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 10th, 2009 at 5:56am #

    using the word “influence” , which ‘zionists’ exert on US foreign policy [since when? 50’s?] means that one can’t ever obtain an exact picture of what is going on in US.
    the word influence can be likened onto words like “justice”, “peace process”, “security”, “terrorism” and many such lofty but misleading words.
    such words are misleading because schooling, media, clero-political class had imbued thsese words with false symbolic values.
    such words are used because they symbolize enormous number of events; resulting almost always in chery picking/dropping just one, two, or few events in order to lead people astray.
    damn it! It always works! In italy, germany, and japan in ’39-45 period also.
    and it takes to drop only one salient fact to present a fictive reality and off we go accepting such strategems as honesty, truth, defense, etc.

  89. bozhidar balkas vancouver said on July 10th, 2009 at 6:07am #

    in last elections, nader had gotten ab. 650K votes. Wld he have received another mn votes had the ‘critics’ of US foreign policy urged people to vote for nader?
    in next election the [closet?] critics/leftists wld have a chance to correct historical ?blunder or willful laming of the Left in US.
    if they do not, then we shld boycott them even now.
    i have already sworn off many writers in DV and ICH. I had enough of that in MSM. I don’t read MSM or watch CNN. I am not going to read anything by any asocialist. tnx

  90. mebosa ritchie said on July 12th, 2009 at 5:53am #


    Israel crushes Russia in tennis history
    Sensational. Incredible. Stunning. Amazing.
    Ram and Erlich celebrate a point against Safin and Kunitsyn on Saturday.
    It is difficult to find the words to describe the magnitude of Israel’s historic 3-0 victory over Russia in the Davis Cup quarterfinals at the Nokia Arena in Tel Aviv on Friday and Saturday.

    Until Saturday Israel had never made it past the quarterfinals of the competition, and reached the last eight only once, 22 years ago when it lost to India in New Delhi.

    But this all changed over two days of outstanding tennis.

    After Harel Levy and Dudi Sela put the home side 2-0 up with superb performances in the opening singles matches on Friday, Andy Ram and Yoni Erlich finished the job off on Saturday, winning a nail biting five-setter against Marat Safin and Igor Kunitsyn.

    Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu phoned Israel Tennis Association CEO Moshe Haviv on Saturday night to congratulate him on the Davis Cup team’s historic achievement.

  91. Noisy Tappet said on July 12th, 2009 at 9:28am #

    Nokia’s another one that goes on the boycott list.

  92. mebosa ritchie said on July 12th, 2009 at 11:45am #

    nosy,you must add microsoft,intel,motorola to your boycott list and don’t forget to throw your cellphone away
    it will make you feel warm inside that you’re doing something

  93. mary said on July 16th, 2009 at 11:07am #

    ‘Boarish Emetic’ always has to have the last word and much good may it do him.

  94. dan e said on July 16th, 2009 at 12:48pm #

    Boycott Lesser-Evilism. Chomsky and his ilk, no matter what their academic or other achievements, are first of all Zio-Symps, i.e., friends of Zionized ne0-Imperialism. If you want to do something effective to oppose “current US policy”, to oppose these wars/occupations/colonialist state terrorism, you need to wean yourself from the notion that a person can be a Democratic Pty activist and still be a decent person.
    We can boycott, we can at great risk and sacrifice deliver a tiny smidge of humanitarian aid, we can engage in “Progressive Activities” 24/7 — but as long as we keep playing footsie with these “now you see them, now you don’t” Liberals such as Chomsky and pals, nothing will change.
    Which isn’t to say that we can’t from time to time work for objectives that some Democrats may also support, at least verbally. But we have to be clear that such temporary tactical convergences are just that, and not get confused about who these Liberal Zionists really are, and what role they play in the overall scheme of things. They’re really part & parcel of the War Machine, just as much as Bush & Cheney.

  95. B99 said on July 16th, 2009 at 1:12pm #

    Max – Obamabat?? Everytime we have a conversation you get hostile (actually you get hostile with most everyone) – and then step in a big Green Bucket of snot. First, you tried to establish yourself as Mr Green on this site without knowing the slightest bit of history of the Greens in America. In fact, you were dead wrong on their history – shall I review our exchange for you? Then you tried to cover it up with half-baked throw-away comments such as denigrating Kirkpatrick Sale – as if that would equalize our arguments (to wit, that I was lying to say the Greens existed in the 1990s was balanced by the fact that Kirk Sale was not so important, anyway).

    Then you put your other foot in the snot bucket with your DNA reference to Israelis/Zionists/Jews – which reference puts you in league with all those reactionairies and racists who think that Jews have different genetic propensities than the rest of us. So you madly go over the record to count how many times I referred to Jews in my posts – only to find out that I use the term intentionally because it corresponds to using Palestinian. But you had already fallen into the trap of not using the term Jews because not all Jews are Zionists. As if all Palestinians, or for that matter, all of any group are one thing.

    I’d say you’d be better off on the Green campaign trail, but apparently your anger got the best of you there as well.

  96. Deadbeat said on July 16th, 2009 at 1:20pm #

    dan e writes …

    but as long as we keep playing footsie with these “now you see them, now you don’t” Liberals such as Chomsky and pals, nothing will change.

    The way to weed out these liberal zionist is for the Left to mount a serious campaign against ALL FORM of Racism (i.e. Zionism) especially in the United States. Clearly there has been a shift as more people are starting to focus on Israel and its practices but there has to be greater focus on how Zionism has affected the U.S. political economy. Confronting Zionism is probably the weakest link in the overall aspects of U.S. Imperialism because there are already foot-soldiers in this battle. It’s up to the Left to help organizes people of color who are ready allies in this battle.

    The liberal Zionist especially reveal themselves when it comes to the issue of Racism especially when it comes to confronting Zionism.

  97. B99 said on July 16th, 2009 at 1:23pm #

    Mebosa – The UN never declared Jerusalem an international city. That was a UN General Assembly recommendation – part of a package of recommendations rejected by the Palestinians as was their right. And the issue was not raised again by the UN. Then, beginning in late 1947 the Jews began their armed conquest of all of Palestine, eventually doing battle with King Abdallah’s forces on the West Bank after a period where they agreed not to attack each other. The Jews – now Israeli Jews – conquered most of Jerusalem – the Jordanians retained East Jerusalem.

    The Jews routinely blew up and bulldozed mosques, churches and shrines before, during, and after the 48/49 war. Even today, Israel is building a Museum of Tolerance over a Muslim cemetary in Jerusalem. Hows that for Orwellian irony?

    To this day, Muslims do not have free access to the Temple Mount. The Israeli military closes it arbitrarily. The Temple Mount will not be free until the Occupation of Palestine ends.

    everyone is free to visit israel including free access to all the holy sites in jerusalem.
    when the un declared jerusalem an international city,the jordanian-palestinians took over the eastern bit and closed off and desecrated jewish and christian holy sites.
    and the un did nothing
    it is only since israel recovered the city in 1967 that the world has had free access to all the holy sites including muslim ones

  98. B99 said on July 16th, 2009 at 1:24pm #

    Oops, last paragraph of prior message is Mebosa’s – forgot to delete it.

  99. B99 said on July 16th, 2009 at 2:44pm #

    Bozh –

    Actually, the US and other Western Countries do not quibble with the UN assignation of the WB & G being illegally occupied. The US has but once changed the terminology to ‘disputed’ but has not repeated that term again.

    The UN voted incorrectly to recognize Israel and admit it to the UN because it was controlled by the powers that emerged out of WWII – including socialist states. But if these resolutions can be reversed then so too can all the resolutions favoring the Palestinians.

    But yes, the UN is definitely obligated to impose sanctions on Israel – and demand it remove itself from the WB& G and repatriate the refugees as it promised to gain admission to the UN. And if sanctions do not work, the UN is obligated to step up the pressure up to and including military action. Israel should be held to the same standard that Iraq was held for invading Kuwait. That would go a long way towards establishing true credibility to the UN. But that cannot happen without US permission, perhaps when hell freezes over. And I can’t think of a UN force taking such action against a nuclear power.