9/11 and the “War on Terrorism”: Facts and Myths

A recent New York Times article examined how Arabs in the Middle East don’t believe the official story of what happened on September 11, 2001 and are rather apt to think the U.S. Government itself had a hand in the terrorist attacks. The title of the article dismisses the notion, reading “9/11 Rumors That Become Conventional Wisdom”. But what the Times fails to recognize is that behind many myths often lies an element of truth.

The article begins, “Seven years later, it remains conventional wisdom here that Osama bin Laden and Al Qaeda could not have been solely responsible for the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, and that the United States and Israel had to have been involved in their planning, if not their execution, too.”

This is the talk, the article notes, in Dubai, in Algiers, in Riyadh, and in Cairo. A Syrian man living and working in the United Arab Emirates told the Times, “I think the U.S. Organized this so that they had an excuse to invade Iraq for the oil.”

This kind of thinking, the Times tells us “represents the first failure in the fight against terrorism — the inability to convince people here that the United States is, indeed, waging a campaign against terrorism, not a crusade against Muslims.”

No, the U.S. Is not waging a crusade against Muslims. But neither is it waging a campaign against terrorism. No doubt, Ahmed Issab, the Syrian quoted above, could point out to the Times that this is one of the biggest myths of them all, as the case of Iraq clearly demonstrates.

Iraq has repeatedly been called “the central front in the war on terrorism” by President Bush and others. And it certainly became so, as was well predicted would occur — as a result of the U.S. Invasion.

To speak of myths that have become conventional wisdom, take the notion that there was an “intelligence failure” leading up to the war on Iraq. This is pure nonsense. There was no intelligence failure. The simple fact of the matter, easily demonstrable, is that U.S. Government officials lied about, misled, spun, and exaggerated the “threat” posed by Iraq and it’s alleged WMD and supposed ties to al Qaeda. To document the deceptions employed is beyond our purposes here; suffice to say that there never was any credible evidence that Iraq still possessed weapons of mass destruction, or that it had any sort of operational relationship with al Qaeda. Many people, myself included, were saying that for many months before the U.S. Invaded, and time certainly confirmed the truth of what we were trying to warn others about.

And how can one argue that the war against Iraq was waged to combat terrorism? What evidence is there of this? We have only the declarations of benevolent intent from the same people who engaged in a campaign of deception to convince the American public of the necessity of the war in the first place. Sure, they say it’s a “war on terrorism”. But statements of intent are not evidence. Saddam Hussein was a brutal dictator who terrorized his own people. But the U.S. didn’t care about that. After all, our government supported Saddam during his most heinous crimes; including when he “gassed his own people”, killing 5,000, in the village of Halabjah.

Moreover, it was well predicted by every competent analyst that invading Iraq would only cause more resentment towards the U.S. And hatred of its foreign policies. A war in Iraq would be a “poster” for al Qaeda, many experts noted, and recruitment at militant schools and terrorist training camps would only increase as a result. The world would become an even more dangerous place and acts of terrorism would only increase.

It would have been welcome had such dire predictions been wrong. But they weren’t. Acts of terrorism worldwide have increased considerably since the “war on terrorism” began. A great many of these terrorist incidents have occurred in Iraq, a country where such heinous crimes were virtually unknown prior to the U.S. Invasion.

And there’s the even bigger fact that war itself is terrorism. In fact, the crime of aggression is even worse than state-sponsored international terrorism under international law. A war of aggression is “the supreme international crime”, as defined at Nuremberg, “differing only from other crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole.”

But what about Afghanistan? It’s “the good war”, after all, we’re told. Even many who opposed the invasion of Iraq were in favor of invading Afghanistan and overthrowing the Taliban. But there’s an all-too-often missing context here, too, that should be considered when ultimately judging U.S. military intervention. And that is that the Taliban — and al Qaeda — is ultimately a creation of U.S. foreign policy.

The U.S. support for the Afghan mujahedeen is well known. But in the official history the myth is propagated — regarded as conventional wisdom — that this support for the radical militants President Reagan called “freedom fighters” was a response to the Soviet invasion. In fact, covert aid began under Carter six months prior to the Soviet invasion, and according to Carter’s national security advisor Zbigniew Brzezinski himself, the purpose was to try to draw the Soviets in to a conflict — to give them “their Vietnam war”, as he put it.

So the CIA financed, armed, and trained — acting through their intermediary, Pakistan’s Inter-Service Intelligence agency (ISI) — the most radical militants they could find. One Gulbaddin Hekmatyar, for instance, was the principle recipient of U.S. aid. His name is still in the media from time to time — he is now one of the principle enemies fighting U.S. coalition forces in Afghanistan.

And, of course, the CIA’s base of operations was in Peshawar, Pakistan. Religious schools, or madrassas, were established along Pakistan’s northwest border regions, where recruits were trained and radicalized to fight the Soviets. In fact, it is from these madrassas that the movement known as the Taliban would later come — “Taliban” is the plural form of “Talib”, Pashto for “student”.

And another well known figure of the Soviet-Afghan war also set up his base of operations in Peshawar — Osama bin Laden. At the very least, the CIA was knowledgeable of and approved bin Laden’s operations. In fact, the U.S. looked the other way while branches of his organization established bases of operation within the United States, and may have even actively supported his efforts with the mindset during the “Cold War” that “the enemy of my enemy is my friend”.

Before bin Laden’s organization became known as “al Qaeda”, or “the Base”, it was known as Makhtab al-Khidamat. Either as an alias or subsidiary branch, it was also known as Al Kifah. The U.S. Department of the Treasury has this to say about it: “Makhtab al-Khidamat/Al Kifah (MK) is considered to be the pre-cursor organization to al Qaida and the basis for its infrastructure. MK was initially created by Usama bin Laden’s (UBL) mentor, Shaykh Abdullah Azzam, who was also the spiritual founder of Hamas, as an organization to fund mujahideen in the Soviet-Afghan conflict. MK has helped funnel fighters and money to the Afghan resistance in Peshawar, Pakistan, and had established recruitment centers worldwide to fight the Soviets.”

One of those recruitment centers was the Alkifah Refugee Center in Brooklyn, New York. One of the mosques from which a certain Omar Abdel Rahman, a.k.a. “the Blind Sheikh”, preached was a few doors down from Alkifah.

The Sheikh was good friends with Gulbaddin Hekmatyar, and had travelled to Peshawar to meet with the CIA’s favored beneficiary.

Despite being on the terrorist watch list, Sheikh Omar was allowed to enter the U.S. In fact, his visa was approved by the CIA. And in fact, the Sheikh travelled in and out of the country at will and it was the CIA itself which reviewed and approved his application on at least six separate occasions.

You read correctly. It was reported in the New York Times, in several separate stories, that the CIA had approved a known suspected terrorist, believed to have masterminded acts of terrorism in Egypt, including the assassination of President Anwar Sadat, and allowed him into the country, where he helped to recruit young Muslims through a cell in the organization that would eventually become known as al Qaeda.

What’s more, that same individual would later be named as one of the masterminds of the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center.

There’s much more to that story, too — such as the case of one Ali Mohammed, terrorist mastermind extraordinaire. If you’ve never heard of him, that’s perhaps not too surprising. Despite being named as one of the planners and organizers of the 1993 WTC bombing and having a web of connections that suggest he was also a principle figure in paving the way for the terrorist cells that would carry out the 9/11 attacks, his name is rarely mentioned. That might have something to do with the embarrassing fact that Mohammed was a Green Beret in the U.S. Army and at one time or another worked for both the FBI and the CIA.

But lest we digress down that road too much further, let us return to the war in Afghanistan. Not everyone agreed after 9/11 that invading Afghanistan was the correct response to that horrible atrocity. Many of us argued that waging a war that would certainly result in even more innocent people being killed would not be justice. Indeed, more Afghan civilians were killed in the first several months of the war than died on 9/11. Many more have died since then in the violence that is ongoing, nearly seven years later.

And those of us who opposed this military action also pointed out that the people whom the U.S. was gearing up to recruit as its allies in the fight against the Taliban, the leaders of the so-called Northern Alliance, were many of the same brutal warlords whom the Afghan people were so glad to be rid of the first time that they actually welcomed the Taliban as liberators when the Taliban drove the warlords out.

And we warned that such action would only destabilize the region further. Just as the U.S.’s intervention in Afghanistan throughout the 80s — and its total abandonment of the country it used as its battlefield in its proxy war against the Soviet Union; a war that devastated the nation, killed a million of its inhabitants, and made refugees out of three million more — resulted in the “blowback” terrorism of the 90s and of 9/11, so too would yet another major war in Afghanistan sow the seeds of misery and death and hatred that could only end in more “blowback” in the future.

Afghanistan, for instance, is the world’s leading producer of opium poppies. Most of the world’s heroin is now manufactured from poppies grown in Afghanistan. The drug trade in Afghanistan initially grew and flourished during the Soviet-Afghan war. If not actually participating in the trade itself (for which there is precedent), the CIA at the very least turned a blind eye while its main assets profited from drug trafficking and used the proceeds to help fight the war against the Soviet occupation. Afghanistan became the world’s leading producer of opium during this period.

Then the Taliban succeeded in nearly eradicating the crop in 2001. But with their overthrow, many — including warlord allies of the U.S. — began profiting once more from the trade. It wasn’t long after the ousting of the Taliban that experts began warning that Afghanistan was becoming a narco-terrorist state. Opium production grew to surpass all previous records. And while there has been some success, mostly in just the past year, in eradicating the crop from government-controlled provinces, production has increased in areas now under control of the resurging Taliban.

Moreover, members of al Qaeda and the Taliban, most likely including Osama bin Laden — who, needless to say, was never caught — fled into Pakistan, where they reestablished themselves. The chickens had gone home to roost. The war on Afghanistan has led directly to the increasing destabilization of neighboring nuclear-armed Pakistan.

Fortunately, there is some hope that the principles of democracy might prevail in Pakistan, where the prevailing public mind is more moderate and who view the militants and terrorists as a plague upon their land – a plague that was allowed not only a place to sustain itself, but to grow and expand under the government of Pervez Musharraf.

After 9/11, Pakistan’s President Pervez Musharraf pledged to assist the U.S. in its “war on terrorism.” This was an absurdity. Pakistan had been up to that very day the principle benefactor of the Taliban, and arguably continued to be long after. Pakistan’s shadowy intelligence agency, the ISI — sometimes referred to as a state within a state – has long been accused of links to terrorists and acts of terrorism.

In fact, according to reports in the international media (it only received one brief mention in the U.S., outside of the alternative media, in a blog on the Wall Street Journal’s Opinion Journal website) — including Pakistan’s Dawn, the Times of India, Agence-France Presse, the London Times, and the Guardian — it was the head of the ISI himself, Gen. Mahmud Ahmed, who was responsible for authorizing the transfer by Omar Sayeed Sheikh of $100,000 to 9/11 hijacker Mohammed Atta.

According to the reports, the FBI had worked in tandem with India’s intelligence services to track where the 9/11 “money trail” led to — until it ended up leading to the ISI chief himself. Then suddenly the story of the money trail — up until then big news — quietly disappeared from the headlines. Mahmud Ahmed was even more quietly removed and replaced just as the story broke.

The Bush administration opposed any independent investigation of 9/11. It was only due to tremendous public pressure, with the families of 9/11 victims themselves taking a lead role, that led to the 9/11 Commission being established — a commission that only with the greatest cynicism could one call “independent”. The families submitted lists of questions for the 9/11 Commission to investigate and answer. One of them had to do with the alleged financing of the operation by Pakistan’s ISI chief.

The Commission report is not silent on the matter of financing. No, indeed. It states that no evidence has emerged indicating the involvement of any state or government official in the attacks. What’s more, it states that ultimately the question of who financed the attacks “is of little practical significance.”

That’s right. The 9/11 Commission concluded in its report that it isn’t important to follow the money trail leading to those ultimately responsible for this crime. We know for a fact that its members were made aware of the allegations of ISI involvement, so they can’t claim ignorance as an excuse. And if the Commission in fact investigated the allegations and found that they were unsubstantiated, wouldn’t that be worthy of even a footnote? Instead, the report simply denies with its silence that the reports even exist and tries to convince its readers that they needn’t bother to trouble themselves with the question. Don’t look at that man behind the curtain.

But again we digress. Despite continuing evidence of Pakistani support for terrorists and armed militants from within the ISI and Pakistani military, the U.S. continued to back Musharraf, a dictator who seized power in a coup in 1999. The government in Washington continued to support him even as he held a fraud election last year, declared martial law, suspended the constitution, replaced judges — including on Pakistan’s Supreme Court — with his own lackeys, and cracked down on his political opposition — all in the name of fighting terrorism, a cynical euphemism he could only get away with under the backing of those in Washington only too well familiar with employing the same rhetorical device to push through their own ideologically driven policies and agendas.

There is no shortage in history of governments violating human rights and freedoms in the name of security. That trend continues today, and the United States is no exception.

Returning to the point, the fact is that those who argue that the U.S. is fighting a “war on terrorism” don’t have a leg to stand on. The very notion is an absurdity. The world’s leading culprit of state-sponsored terrorism — the only country ever to have been found guilty of what amounts to international terrorism, the “unlawful use of force”, for its proxy terrorist war against the elected government of Nicaragua (giving the U.S. the benefit of the doubt that its actions didn’t amount to the even greater crime of aggression) by the World Court — cannot possibly fight a “war on terrorism”.

This would be like Panama declaring under Manuel Noriega (a long-time CIA asset) that it was waging a “war on drugs.”

It’s an absurdity to even suggest that the “greatest purveyor of violence in the world today”, as Martin Luther King, Jr. put it during the war against Vietnam (words that ring even more true today), could be fighting a “war on terrorism”, particularly by such means as invading and bombing other countries. Bringing death, sorrow, and even further hardship to peoples of other regions does not help bring about an end of the scourge of terrorism that plagues the Earth. It only contributes to that scourge.

So let’s return to the Times’ assumption that there is a “campaign against terrorism” going on. This is a myth. On the opinion of Mr. Ahmed Issab that 9/11 was actually the result of a plot by the U.S. government to serve as a pretext for expanding its global hegemony overseas, the author of the piece states, “It is easy for Americans to dismiss such thinking as bizarre.”

Perhaps the Times reporter has spent too much time overseas. One needn’t travel to Riyadh or Cairo to find people who believe just that. There’s no shortage of Americans who share in that belief.

Such Americans point to the fact that the so-called neo-conservatives setting policy in the Bush administration are the same bunch of folks who had for so long argued that the U.S. needed a “transformation” of its military into a force capable of fighting multiple simultaneous wars to be able to further the goal of global hegemony, particularly over the energy-rich Middle East and Central Asian regions.

They point out that plans to overthrow the Taliban existed prior to the 9/11 attacks, and that Iraq — its people long the victim of the U.S. policy of “regime change” — was in the government’s sights immediately after the attacks, despite there not being any evidence of Iraqi involvement whatsoever.

They also point out that there was a consensus among policy-makers that this “transformation” and the expansion of U.S. global dominance could not happen without some sort of catalyst — “like a new Pearl Harbor”, to use their own words. And these same planners were among those to compare the 9/11 attacks to the attack on Pearl Harbor after the fact. 9/11, some even said openly, was an “opportunity” to further their goals for the U.S. in its foreign policy.

But the Times, while suggesting the idea is without foundation, says we shouldn’t dismiss such thinking as that expressed by Mr. Issab. The reason given is instructive; to do so would be to fail to learn the lesson that the U.S. has failed “in the fight against terrorism” to actually “convince people” in the Middle East “that the United States is, indeed, waging a campaign against terrorism”.

In other words, the U.S. is losing the propaganda war.

The Times notes that many Arabs are convinced that the U.S. and Israel were actually behind the 9/11 attacks. “The rumors that spread shortly after 9/11 have been passed on so often that people no longer know where or when they first heard them. At this point, they have heard them so often, even on television, that they think they must be true.”

It is indeed a disturbing trend, for whole groups of people to believe something is true just because it is repeated on television again and again. Take, for another example, the widely held belief among Americans that Iraq was a threat to the U.S. and had weapons of mass destruction. One poll taken by the Washington Post showed that as many 70% of Americans actually believed that Saddam Hussein was involved in the 9/11 attacks.

But let’s get back to the rumors the Times tells us Arabs have come to regard as fact.

“First among these,” the article continues, “is that Jews did not go to work at the World Trade Center on that day. Asked how Jews might have been notified to stay home, or how they kept it a secret from co-workers, people here wave off the questions because they clash with their bedrock conviction that Jews are behind many of their troubles and that Western Jews will go to any length to protect Israel.”

Of course, it is true that it is an urban legend that no Jews went to work at the WTC on September 11. But that myth seems to have sprung from the fact that there were indeed reports that Jews working in the building were warned of the coming attack. One is tempted to dismiss this with the assumption that it is propaganda from Arab media sources. In fact, it was an Israeli paper, Haaretz, that reported that workers at Odigo, an Israeli owned messaging service company with an office four blocks from the WTC, had received warnings that very day of an impending attack.

The Washington Post followed up on the report, saying that officials at Odigo “confirmed today that two employees received text messages warning of an attack on the World Trade Center two hours before terrorists crashed planes into the New York landmarks.” Despite the fact that Odigo said it had the IP address of the sender and was working with the FBI to track down whoever was responsible, to the best of my knowledge it was never reported that they either succeeded or failed in doing so.

Incidentally, Odigo was partnered with another Israeli company called Comverse.

Fox News reported in a series of reports on the uncovering of a massive Israeli spy ring operating in the U.S., saying that “There is no indication that the Israelis were involved in the 9-11 attacks, but investigators suspect that they may have gathered intelligence about the attacks in advance and not shared it.” One investigator told Fox News, “Evidence linking these Israelis to 9-11 is classified, I cannot tell you about evidence that has been gathered.”

As many as 60 Israelis were detained on suspicion of their participation in the spy ring. Part of their operation involved supposed “art students” trying to get into the homes of government personnel, including members of the military, the DEA, FBI, and other law enforcement and intelligence personnel, under the guise of selling art.

Fox News also revealed that “virtually all call records and billing in the U.S. are done for the phone companies by Amdocs Ltd., an Israeli-based private communications company.” According to Fox News, the National Security Agency (NSA) has warned U.S. intelligence and law-enforcement numerous times about the potential security breaches that this situation could make possible.

Reporter Carl Cameron also noted that Israel’s intelligence agency, Mossad, had warned the U.S. of a possible attack prior to 9/11, but that the warning “was nonspecific and general, and [investigators] believe that it may have had something to do with the desire to protect what are called sources and methods in the intelligence community; the suspicion being, perhaps those sources and methods were taking place right here in the United States.”

The third report in the series reported on another Israeli company that “provides wiretapping equipment for law enforcement.” The company? Comverse Infosys. But there were fears about the system Comverse provided because “wiretap computer programs made by Comverse have, in effect, a back door through which wiretaps themselves can be intercepted by unauthorized parties. Adding to the suspicions is the fact that in Israel, Comverse works closely with the Israeli government, and under special programs, gets reimbursed for up to 50 percent of its research and development costs by the Israeli Ministry of Industry and Trade.”

“But,” Cameron added, “investigators with the DEA, INS and FBI have all told Fox News that to pursue or even suggest Israeli spying through Comverse is considered career suicide.”

A fourth installment in the series noted that the number of Israeli citizens that had been detained as suspected members of a foreign intelligence operation was nearly 200, and that most of them had been deported. Most “had served in the Israeli military, which is compulsory there. But they also had, most of them, intelligence expertise, and either worked for Amdocs or other companies in Israel that specialize in wiretapping.”

The Jewish newspaper Forward reported that, “In recent years two reports, one by the Government Accounting Office, the other by the Defense Intelligence Agency, warned against Israeli economic and military espionage activity in the United States. In addition, the FBI conducted an investigation during the late 1990s into alleged Israeli wiretapping of the White House, the State Department and the National Security Council. The investigation ended in May 2000 without any result, according to The New York Times.”

Then there were the reports of the five dancing Israelis who were arrested after behaving suspiciously upon witnessing the burning towers from New Jersey. The five were witnessed by their white van videotaping or taking photos of the smoking buildings and celebrating. The FBI put out an alert on the vehicle after a witness reported its license plate number, which was registered to a company called Urban Moving Systems, an Israeli owned company.

When they were found, the driver told the arresting officers, “We are Israeli. We are not your problem. Your problems are our problems. The Palestinians are the problem.” The suspects’ names came up in a search of the national intelligence database and they were suspected of conducting an intelligence operation. Forward noted that Urban Moving was a “company with few discernable assets that close up shop immediately afterward and whose owner fled to Israel.”

Forward also noted the Israeli “art students” who had been detained on suspicion of espionage, and added that “a counterintelligence investigation by the FBI concluded that at least two” of the Israelis seen celebrating the attacks on the World Trade Center “were in fact Mossad operatives”.

Reports such as these naturally fueled any number of conspiracy theories surrounding the events of 9/11. But the fact remains that despite two so-called “investigations” into 9/11, first the Joint Inquiry and then the 9/11 Commission, countless questions remain yet unanswered about just about every facet of the attacks.

Many of the alleged hijackers, to name just one further notable example, have been reported by reputable news agencies, such as the BBC, as being alive and well.

The New York Times article continues: “Americans might better understand the region, experts here said, if they simply listen to what people are saying — and try to understand why — rather than taking offense. The broad view here is that even before Sept. 11, the United States was not a fair broker in the Arab-Israeli conflict, and that it capitalized on the attacks to buttress Israel and undermine the Muslim Arab world.

“The single greatest proof, in most people’s eyes, was the invasion of Iraq. Trying to convince people here that it was not a quest for oil or a war on Muslims is like convincing many Americans that it was, and that the 9/11 attacks were the first step.”

“There are Arabs who hate America, a lot of them, but this is too much,” Hisham Abbas, a student at Cairo University told the Times. “And look at what happened after this – the Americans invaded two Muslim countries. They used 9/11 as an excuse and went to Iraq.”

Of course, under the prevailing assumption that defines the framework for the article, such ideas, though perhaps “conventional wisdom” in the Middle East, should be considered merely “rumors”.

The conventional wisdom, on the other hand, that the U.S. is fighting a “campaign against terrorism”, is accepted by the Times without question — it is simply an article of faith. Yet the conventional wisdom shared by the Times that there is no truth to the “rumors” that many people in the Middle East believe is belied by the facts. In many cases, there are elements of truth behind the myths that deserve our attention and demand answers to the reasonable questions they precipitate.

Americans would do well to take the above advice, given by experts in the Middle East and relayed to us through the New York Times, into consideration; to try to listen to what people in the Middle East are saying, and to understand.

If we ever truly wish to engage in a campaign against terrorism, that would be an elementary first step and a worthy alternative to spreading even more violence.

Jeremy R. Hammond is the editor of Foreign Policy Journal, a website providing news, analysis, and opinion from outside the standard framework provided by government officials and the corporate media. He was among the recipients of the 2010 Project Censored Awards for outstanding investigative journalism and is the author of The Rejection of Palestinian Self-Determination. You can contact him at: jeremy@foreignpolicyjournal.com. Read other articles by Jeremy, or visit Jeremy's website.

31 comments on this article so far ...

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  1. bozhidar bob balkas said on September 11th, 2008 at 7:42am #

    perps of 9/11 were US’ friends. but, obviously, the funni uncle cldn’t bomb his friends, so he bombed his friend’s neigbors.
    and, to boot, the neighbors were terrible to all the other neighbors.
    and to boot, there are just to many people on the planet. and to boot, amers will never see these bombs go blow.
    besides, there were so many bombs rusting away that cost so much money and arms manufacturer promising to make better weapons. uncle said, yah, why not, use the damn things.

  2. John Hatch said on September 11th, 2008 at 6:51pm #

    Good article.

    I don’t think anyone anywhere except in the USA believes the official version regarding 9/11.

    We are asked to believe that for the first time since Jesus (supposedly) walked on water, the laws of physics were temporarily suspended so that three buildings (one undamaged) could fall straight down at free-fall speed.

    We are asked to disbelieve our own senses (and sense of logic) and instead believe Mr. Bush and Mr. Cheney. Some Americans are apparently docile and dumb enough to comply, but almost no one else.

  3. Joseph Danison said on September 11th, 2008 at 7:37pm #

    A better approach to the subject is the demolition of the towers. That is ground zero of unimpeachable fact.

    From this demolition emerged the “war on terrorism”, the attack on Afghanistan, and equally important, the simultaneous attack on the Constitution with the legislative weapon of the Patriot Act.

    To engage the NYT in argument means to grant credibility to the lies, the myth it is selling to the world, even if one is sharp, with all the facts at one’s fingertips.

    Better to stick to the facts. Discoursing with madmen is hazardous to one’s mental health.

    They blew up the WTC, passed unconstitutional legislation, launched war against the Muslim world.

    This means they want to dominate the richest oil region in the world and suppress domestic opposition at home.

    It also means that the world’s most powerful military machine will get rusty if it isn’t used regularly.

    It’s not complicated. What is complicated is why so many people find the simple truth so difficult to comprehend.

  4. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 11th, 2008 at 8:48pm #

    “A better approach to the subject is the demolition of the towers.”

    I disagree 100%. I think talking about the towers is absolutely the worst way to approach 9/11 truth.

    There are hundreds of other angles you could approach the subject from to better get through to people about how “they want to dominate the richest oil region in the world and suppress domestic opposition at home”.

    Appearances aside, you’ve got top experts in their field providing explanations for the towers’ collapse (including the new NIST report on WTC 7), and that is going to take precedence in the minds of most educated people over some “conspiracy theorist” babble about controlled demolitions. No offense. I’m a skeptic, too, on the towers. But that’s just the way most people are going to see it.

    And you know what? What do I know? I don’t know about you, but I’m not an engineer. My brother is, on the other hand. In fact, he studies building failures. He doesn’t think demolitions brought the buildings down. And as much as it LOOKS that way to me, he’s an expert who says there’s a scientific explanation. I can’t argue with that. He’s not in on the conspiracy. And he’s not stupid, as you imply anyone must be who doesn’t agree with you on the matter.

    The fact is that the experts in their fields are telling us that, despite all appearances, it was fire and structural damage that brought the buildings down. Are they all in on the conspiracy? Are are all these top scientists just morons? People don’t reach the top of their profession in scientific fields by being dummies.

    Hell, I was 100% convinced WTC 7 was a controlled demolition for 7 years. Until I read the latest report. Prior to NIST’s report, the fact is we never had a single reasonable explanation for how that building could fall that way. As much as people dismiss it, if you read it it makes some sense. I’m still skeptical, but the report does provide a scientific explanation for the collapse. It’s a credible report (unlike FEMA’s).

    Forget the towers. It’s been 7 years. People either believe it was controlled demolitions or don’t at this point. Those that do can go on and on about it, but they’re beating a dead horse.

    I’m not saying it’s not an important question. It’s just not the best way to educate people about the government’s complicity in 9/11.

    “Better to stick to the facts.”

    Implying I didn’t? If this is your belief, perhaps you could point to me where I strayed away from the facts.

    I didn’t footnote this article, but I can provide documentation for every statement I made.

  5. Andres Kargar said on September 11th, 2008 at 11:12pm #

    What would you do if you knew in the year 2001 what you know about the state of the world today? If you had the scientists and the think-tanks and the analysts to report to you the facts? What would you do?

    They knew their corporations were bankrupt because they themselves had sucked all the livelihood out of those neo-liberal structures.
    Even though they denied it, they knew about global warming and its disastrous effects.
    They knew the situation with the fossil fuels and the ever-increasing demand for oil. Whoever controlled the oil would be controlling the world.

    If they sat and did nothing, the people would dice them to smithereens. They have lived the good life on the people’s shoulders for too long, and they couldn’t change their ways.

    Without an incident like 9/11, the American people would never accept the invasion of the Middle East. So the neo-conservatives paid a visit to their Saudi friends.

    Do you know now why Cheney’s energy policy was kept secret?

  6. Joseph Danison said on September 12th, 2008 at 3:30pm #

    Jeremy, who do you think comprised the NIST group that advanced the erroneous pancake theory? MIT engineers, for the most part. Each of them responding to pressure and/or bribes. Give a listen to Kevin Ryan.

    My suspicion is that your brother hasn’t examined the evidence or he, like so many Americans, cannot bear to consider the truth. I heard a fellow proclaim that if he thought 911 was an inside job, he couldn’t bear to live another day in this country.

    Fact: 110 story steel framed buildings do not collapse at near free fall speed as a result of structural failure of any kind. Ask your brother to explain how this would be possible. The only possible answer he can give is assisted collapse, the planned demolition of the towers that eliminates resistance.

    Demolition is proven and anyone willing to consider the facts will not argue the case. Again, your brother simply has not studied the evidence.

    All the talk of political motives cannot be proven. Demolition can be.

  7. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 13th, 2008 at 12:17am #

    This is what I mean. We can go back and forth over the towers all day. Meanwhile, the crooks in Washington are laughing their asses off because they’re still in power and still getting away with their crimes.

    You talk about proof, but you’re just stating your opinion.

    The fact is that you can see the outer columns of WTC failing on the video. They didn’t get blown out, they buckled. It’s right on video. There’s one showing the columns at the start of the collapse, and they just buckle under the load right in front of your eyes. That’s not explosives.

    You assume I haven’t asked my brother to explain “how this would be possible”, which is odd since I thought it was pretty clear in my last post that I’d done just that.

    And, yes, my brother has studied the evidence. I know that because I’m the one whose presented the arguments for demolition to him. We’ve discussed and debated it quite extensively.

    Political motives can absolutely be proven. It isn’t difficult. Just read what policymakers have had to say about their own motives in their own documents. Wolfowitz’s Defense Planning Guidance, for instance, or PNAC’s Rebuilding America’s Defenses, or the National Security Strategy, etc. It’s right there plain as day for anyone to see who has eyes to see what their motives are. Nothing ambiguous about it.

  8. siamdave said on September 13th, 2008 at 12:32am #

    Interesting contradictions – you say you knew the reports about Iraq were nonsense from day 1, and to hell with all the US intelligence ‘experts’ – but for the WTC, the word of ‘experts’ from the same gang is fine. There are many scientists and engineers who disagree with the NIST etc reports, you just don’t read about them, ever, in the mainstream media. And as for their veracity, you ought to be well aware that some ‘experts’ or ‘academics’ simply have no real clue what is going on and agree with whoever signs their cheques, that others will lie about anything to advance their career, and yet others will keep silent about something like this if they understand they don’t have much real value to anyone, but do stand to lose their jobs, which are better than anything else they might have available, for saying things their employers don’t want them saying. And for the few who do speak up, as we have seen, widespread ridicule (stupid conspiracy theorist hahaha!!) is instantaneous from the mainstream media, and others who are government sycophants for whatever reason, and there are many who could not stand this kind of public ridicule so keep quiet, no matter what they think or suspect. ‘Science’ has become very compromised the last few decades, as it has caved in to corporate imperatives, so it’s pretty foolish to base any opinion on what some scientist says. The main filter we all should use is our own intelligence and knowledge of the ways of the world. Admittedly there are those who see little space creatures when they ought to be seeing a doctor, but there are many who see a lot of bullshit in the pronouncements of their ‘leaders’, and have the courage to stand on their own integrity rather than giving in like good little citizens to the demands of power, no matter how obviously compromised those demands are. If you rely on things like the NIST report for your beliefs, reports which start from the premise that plane collisions and fires brought down the WTC buildings and how do we go about using whatever ‘facts’ we have (or can manufacture) to prove that, then you are getting a very prejudiced view of what happened. For another perspective, not starting from any preformed conclusions, but just looking at what happened that day and trying to make sense of it, you might start here – a 911 Thought Experiment http://www.rudemacedon.ca/lgi/911-thoughtex.html#ctc . If you find any flaws in the logic, I would be most interested in hearing about them.

    As for the idea that this is old news move on, move on!! – I suppose the Nuremburg lawyers defending the Germans would have been happy to see that kind of principle in effect too, but letting the major criminals of the early years of the 21st century get away with this monstrous crime would be a very, very bad precedent to set. You see it as a non-starter because the perps have covered their tracks very well, I see it as the very center of the battle for the future – if we roll over and play dead on this one, we lose any right we ever claimed for reclaiming democracy in the western countries. You cannot let a crime of this magnitude go unpunished, and expect to have any strength or credibility ever again in the future, especially when it is the perps who are running your country. They will know their power is unassailable if they can get away with this – and so will we.

  9. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 13th, 2008 at 1:20am #

    “Interesting contradictions – you say you knew the reports about Iraq were nonsense from day 1, and to hell with all the US intelligence ‘experts’ – but for the WTC, the word of ‘experts’ from the same gang is fine.”

    I’m afraid you’re manufacturing “contradictions” where there are none. What intelligence experts are you referring to? George Bush? Dick Cheney? Rummy? Condie? Perhaps you mean George Tenet?

    Comparing statements from the likes of these people with the scientists at NIST is, well, nonsense. I have made no contradictions.

    “…it’s pretty foolish to base any opinion on what some scientist says.”

    Right. People who went through years of schooling and training and have experience and knowledge in structural engineering and physics and other sciences are the LAST people we should seek an opinion from when it comes to thinks like, say, building collapses.

    I’d throw in one of those little “rolleyes” smilies here, but it’s not available.

    I don’t know, man. Respectfully, this isn’t any kind of argument.

    And, again, you can sit and talk about the towers all day, but it’s a red herring.

    It’s like the people who say no plane flew into the Pentagon.

    There are bigger fish to fry and other issues and angles to approach 9/11 truth from.

    I like Michael Ruppert’s approach in one of the better 9/11 videos, “Truth and Lies of 9/11”.

    Another good documentary is “9/11: Press for Truth”.

    Forget Loose Change and In Plane Sight and all of the other nonsense videos that just do more harm to the cause of 9/11 truth than good.

    But if you insist in sticking to the towers, here’s a link for you, as well:

    http://wtc.nist.gov/

    If you find any flaws in the logic, I would be most interested in hearing about them.

  10. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 13th, 2008 at 1:31am #

    “These buildings did not, apparently do much more than give a small shake when the planes hit them – well, how much would you expect 500,000 tons to react when hit by a mosquito barely 1/5000 th its weight?”

    See, this is the kind of nonsense you find at sites like “http://www.rudemacedon.ca/lgi/911-thoughtex.html#ctc”.

    Is this really something you expect is going to sway my opinion? I’ve seen it all.

    You speak to me as though you assume I’m just not familiar with this whole other body of information out there. That is a false assumption.

    For seven years, WTC 1 and 2 aside, I’ve been absolutely convinced that WTC 7 must have been caused by controlled demolition, because I couldn’t imagine any other explanation, and none was ever given to us.

    As for 1 and 2, I could see arguments both ways, but what do I know? I’m not an engineer. It just wasn’t a stretch to say, well, if they brought down 7, then what’s to say they didn’t do the same with 1 and 2.

    Now we have a credible report (unlike the FEMA one) with explanations and conclusions from top experts in their field. Hey, I’m still skeptical. The videos they show, for one, don’t look at all like the actual collapse. But I’m just not qualified or educated in that area to be able to debate it with engineers and scientists.

    I talked to Danny Jowenko to seek his comment on the new report, but he had nothing to say about it.

    If any credible experts like Jowenko have anything to say about it, point me their way. But spare me the “little shake” from a “mosquito” hitting the towers nonsense. I don’t have time for it. There’s 15 minutes of my life I won’t get back.

  11. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 13th, 2008 at 1:33am #

    I mean, you say things like “…it’s pretty foolish to base any opinion on what some scientist says.” Then you point me to rudemacedon.com.

    That pretty much says it all, I think.

  12. siamdave said on September 13th, 2008 at 6:18am #

    I see your ‘argument’ skills are somewhere around grade 10 level, so there’s not much to be talking about. Thanks for confirming the arguments in the thought experiment are pretty solid.

  13. Joseph Danison said on September 13th, 2008 at 8:11am #

    Jeremy, you don’t answer the question about free fall and resistance. Where’s the resistance?

    Outer columns buckling imply resistance to the downward momentum. There is almost no resistance because the critical stress points were cut.

    Somehow physical laws were violated in your scenario.

    You’re lying when you say you’ve analyzed the collapse. I wouldn’t hire your engineer brother if he offered his services gratis.

    You, on the other hand, I’d hire if I were in need of a lobbyist to sell sand to Arabs.

  14. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 13th, 2008 at 10:39am #

    Outer columns buckling doesn’t “imply” anything. The fact that you can witness the columns buckling means that the reason for the collapse was structural failure.

    You’re saying bombs did that. But I can watch the video and see that it isn’t bombs causing the failure, but watch the columns buckle and fail entirely.

    It’s instructive that instead of presenting facts, people resort to insults.

    Like I said, I’d rather be discussing more pressing matters relating to 9/11 (foreknowledge, cover-up, ISI financing, no air cover, CIA FBI and Mossad monitoring of hijackers, insider trading, etc, etc, etc), but if people insist on sticking to the towers issue, hey, I’ll discuss it with you. If anyone wants to discuss the matter rationally, I’m more than happy to continue the discussion.

  15. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 13th, 2008 at 10:53am #

    Someone point the bombs out to me in this video:

    http://tw.youtube.com/watch?v=gJbGm7GE1tA

    Watch the columns buckle.

  16. Xavier Fargas said on September 13th, 2008 at 2:16pm #

    Jeremy, first let me say that that’s an impressive article you’ve written. I’m sending it out to my friends.

    If you’ll bear with me, let me point out a couple of things about the youtube video for which you’ve provided a link. Indeed, a column buckling doesn’t necessarily imply much, and therefore I think there might be an error of logic when you assert that the fact than one can see the columns buckling “means that the reason for the collapse was structural failure.”

    You may not be aware of this, but the bulk of the mass of the building was carried by a group of columns at its core. You can see these clearly in old pictures of the construction. Unless I’ve misunderstood what it is you want us to see in the video, it shows the outside columns which form the “grid” pattern giving way to the mass of the building as it falls. But these columns were not carrying most of the weight of the building, and therefore, if you were to cut through those which were, the result would be what you see in the video. The error would be to assume that the building fell because those outside columns failed, when actually both their failure and the fall might well have been a consequence of the destruction of more important supporting structures.

    My suggestion would be to watch the lectures on this topic by physics professor Steven Jones, who put his job on the line to go into this. Without hypothesizing on who did what, he concentrates on the plausibility of the official version of events against evidence which includes analysis of residual chemicals suggesting the use of products used to cut through steel. Just google Steven Jones WTC or something similar, it’s all over the place.

    I look forward to reading more your pen.

  17. Xavier Fargas said on September 13th, 2008 at 2:22pm #

    er…I mean, “more from your pen.”

  18. Joseph Danison said on September 13th, 2008 at 6:52pm #

    Jeremy, I have forgotten, as others have not, to do you the courtesy of saying that your article is quite good for what it is and attempts to do, ie, argue with the NYT.

    The politics of 911 is complex; whereas the destruction of the towers is simple by comparison and defined by the laws of physics. Demonstrate by good authority, which the NIST is not because it is handmaid to the Executive, that the towers were demolished and you have cut off the official lie at the knees.

    This has been the most fruitful approach so far. But, please carry on. You’re a good polemicist.

  19. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 13th, 2008 at 8:38pm #

    Hi Xavier,

    Thanks for your comments. Yes, I’m familiar with the design and construction of the WTC. You are right, the core bore the principle load. If the core columns were cut with explosives, that might explain the outer columns failing, as we see in the video.

    But with the loss of load-bearing columns from the plane impact, along with the weaking of structural elements from the fire could also result in the collapse we see. There is no evidence of explosives in the video.

    We know the floors in the building were failing, because people trapped inside calling loved ones reported the groaning and collapse sounds. The columns bear the load, but without the floors, columns have no lateral support, and failure occurs. A single initial failure could result in a rapid progressive collapse of the core, in turn leading to what we see in the video, the total simultaneous failure of all the outer columns.

    What you DON’T see in the video is explosives destroying the outer columns.

    Also, I’m quite familiar with Steven Jones. His principle argument is that he’s found evidence of the use of thermate.

    I’m not a chemist or physicist or otherwise am schooled in the subject enough to really provide a critique of his argument. But I do know that some of the elements he says show that thermate was used could be otherwise explained, such as the presence of sulfer, which would have been found in the sheetrock that made up the interior office walls, etc.

    Also, thermate is not used for controlled demolitions. One might argue that it COULD be, but how are you even going to attach it to the columns? Whatever you use to hold it there is going to get melted through before the column ever does and there goes your plan. It just doesn’t make sense.

    Moreover, assuming bombs or thermate devices were in the building, how did they get there? Setting up a building like WTC for controlled demolition would be an absolutely enormous undertaking. One could argue that it could be done, but without anyone noticing?

    And you would need a top expert. Most of the world’s top experts on demolitions don’t come from the government, but from family owned operations. Did the government, or whatever element of the government responsible, contract the job out?

    Is, say (to name the “culprit” most often named in arguments I’ve seen that actually follow the logic through this far), the Loizeaux family in on the conspiracy, too? And how many workers must have been involved. They’re all in on it, too? Now we’re impugning the character of a respected family of professionals and accusing them of horrible crimes and atrocities, including murder. And what evidence is there to smear an entire family’s name like that?

    If you follow through with the argument that explosives were used, it just begins to get to the point where the plausibility of the thing becomes quite doubtful.

  20. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 13th, 2008 at 9:07pm #

    Jeremy, I have forgotten, as others have not, to do you the courtesy of saying that your article is quite good for what it is and attempts to do, ie, argue with the NYT.
    The politics of 911 is complex; whereas the destruction of the towers is simple by comparison and defined by the laws of physics. Demonstrate by good authority, which the NIST is not because it is handmaid to the Executive, that the towers were demolished and you have cut off the official lie at the knees.
    This has been the most fruitful approach so far. But, please carry on. You’re a good polemicist.

    Joseph,

    Thanks for the compliment. The article had two purposes: one, to demonstrate that there is no “war on terrorism” and two, to demonstrate that there is some truth behind what the media simply dismisses as “rumor” or myth about 9/11. I only just barely touched just a very few points, but I hope it was sufficient to demonstrate the error implicit in the Times’ framework.

    The politics of 911 is complex, indeed. If one follows the web, there are interconecting points all over the place. Take the case of Sibel Edmonds, the former FBI translator who has been gagged under the “states secrets privelege”. She said that the administration saying they had no warning was an outrageous lie, but that others in the FBI and some high level administration officials were involved through the cover of a Turkish lobby in the nuclear black market. You can follow that trail, and it weaves into AQ Khan and Pakistan, back to the ISI, then back into the past and the BCCI bank used as a front by the CIA. Then it goes into the drugs trade, in Afghanistan, in the Americas, opiates, cocaine, etc. It’s a tangled and frightening web that is most certainly very complex.

    I know people look for simple explanations. To make a confession, I’m playing a bit of devil’s advocate here on the towers. I’m not absolutely convinced one way or the other.

    But that’s just the point. I’ve seen the arguments and whey you get down to it, I just don’t have the knowledge in the relevant areas of science to be able to make an informed judgment. To me it LOOKS like controlled demolition brought down WTC 7, but I have to remain open to the possibility that there is another scientific explanation. And one has now been given. Whatever one thinks about NIST as an institute (and I’d point out that they subcontract out a lot of their work), the fact is they’ve presented a scientific argument that presents a detailed explanation of how fire could have brought the building down in a rapid progressive collapse.

    At this point, it’s over my head. I can’t do the calculations necessary to argue with that. I can’t even begin to. Maybe Steven Jones can, but I haven’t seen him do so. I haven’t seen anyone do so. The issue of the towers isn’t a simple one, either. It’s also a very complex matter, one necessarily involving questions of scientific principles of which I just have no real grasp, beyond an educated layman’s perspective.

    One needn’t have a masters in engineering or a PhD in physics, however, to recognize that when the 9/11 Commission says the question of who financed the attacks is “of little practical significance” is a scandal.

    The fact is that most of the people who argue that the towers were brought down with explosives have absolutely no education or training whatsoever in any of the relevant fields that would grant them a measure of credibility in their educated opinions.

    You have people like Steven Jones and Richard Gage out there, but Jones hasn’t convinced me with his thermate theory. Gage is an architect, not an engineer or physicist. So he has some training in a relevant field to have an informed opinion, but he delves into areas in his talks that are just not his area of expertise. He gives a compelling talk, but for most of the points he makes there are other explanations for events. And when you get down to the stuff that to me remains compelling and raises some tough questions, I’m just not knowledgable enough to be able to answer them. And I’m not sure Gage is, either.

    And most others I see expressing their opinions on the matter aren’t, either.

    We have to listen to the scientists and experts. They’re the ones who are capable of having an educated opinion about it. Most of us can only speculate based on a very limited understanding of the principles and issues involved.

    As I said, I spoke with Danny Jowenko to see if he would be willing to comment and shed some light on it, but he made it pretty clear that he didn’t want to discuss it. Fair enough.

    I’m still seeking answers, but I want real answers from people competent and capable enough of providing them. NIST has provided a compelling exlanation — for the first time — of how fire could cause such a progressive collapse.

    We shouldn’t just dismiss that offhand. If anyone disagrees with their conclusions, by all means, please demonstrate to me the error in their facts or the fallacy in their logic.

    Because at this point in the debate, if the explosives theory is going to continue with any credibility, that’s what will be necessary.

    If trained scientists want to take up that call, great. They can do their thing.

    In the meantime, I’ll continue to do mine, which is to leave the issue of the WTC collapses to others and focus on areas where I can contribute more effectively to the 9/11 truth movement.

  21. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 13th, 2008 at 9:30pm #

    Also, one last point. While people continue to debate how the towers collapsed, the U.S. government continues to perpetrate horrendous crimes in our name. One needn’t demonstrate that the towers were brought down in a controlled demolition to show that we have a criminal government.

    When it became clear Iraq was their next target, how many who opposed it did so by talking about the towers? Was not a better approach to simply demonstrate how they were lying about every single aspect of their case for war?

    Iran has been in their sights, and the war drums continue to beat ever louder. Some argue that this is just psyops intended to intimidate Iran into submission, but should we dismiss the threat? And how shall we approach the matter of the U.S. government or its policeman on the block Israel threatening to bomb Iran? Shall we sit here and debate how the towers came down? Should I try to prevent this from happening by approaching my neighbors and trying to convince them that explosives were used to bring the buildings down? Because most people — no matter how much evidence you have to prove that — are just not going to hear it. What they will hear though, is what the media isn’t telling them, that the IAEA, for instance, has repeatedly stated that there is no evidence Iran has a nuclear weapons program.

    Let’s go back to Afghanistan. How many people opposed to that war tried to convince their friends or family that we shouldn’t go there by arguing about how the towers collapsed?

    How about what’s happening now in Pakistan, and the U.S. destabilization of that country? Should we fight this by going on about the towers? Or should we explain to people how U.S. policies are threatening the stability of a nuclear armed country and how they are contrary to principles of freedom and democracy and recognition of national sovereignty?

    To get back to my original point, even if I was 100% convinced as some of you seem to be that explosives brought down the towers, I would STILL think focusing on the collapses is the absolute worst approach one could take when there are so many other ways to approach the issue of the criminality of our government in ways that will actually get through to people.

    In most cases, pressing the issue of the towers or focusing predominantly on that one issue just does more harm than good. There are other fish to fry and more effective means of getting through to people. I’m not saying it isn’t important and people shouldn’t talk about it, but people also need to recognize when to set it aside.

    If more people had focused on demonstrating to the American people how the government was lying about Iraq, for instance, rather than still going on about the towers, we would have had a much better chance of preventing the invasion.

    It would have been nice to see more “Truth and Lies of 9/11” and less “Loose Change”. We might have done a lot more good.

  22. Xavier Fargas said on September 14th, 2008 at 6:42am #

    Jeremy,

    Thanks for your response. I address some of your observations:

    “…the loss of load-bearing columns from the plane impact, along with the weaking of structural elements from the fire could also result in the collapse we see.”

    The impact didn’t lead to the loss of the core load-bearing columns far below the point of impact, and yet, this would have had to be the case in order for the the collapse to happen at the speed and with the homogeneity it did.

    “There is no evidence of explosives in the video.”
    There is no evidence of explosives in THIS video. But there are plenty of examples to be found of videos comparing the “squib” patterns in controlled demolition with (very) similar patterns in the WTC. And this is just one characteristic. I believe Jones shows some of these, actually.

    “We know the floors in the building were failing, because people trapped inside calling loved ones reported the groaning and collapse sounds.”
    Others reported explosion sounds. The firemen reported explosion sounds in a pattern consistent with controlled demolition.

    “The columns bear the load, but without the floors, columns have no lateral support, and failure occurs. A single initial failure could result in a rapid progressive collapse of the core, in turn leading to what we see in the video, the total simultaneous failure of all the outer columns.”
    I see what you’re saying, but the speed and homogeneity of this collapse could not have involved a “rapid progressive collapse” of the core, it would have had to be almost instantaneous at all failure points in the core columns, not only the outer ones, so as to offer practically no resistance. Or so goes the counterargument. Apparently, the energy does not add up when you don’t consider an external source.

    “What you DON’T see in the video is explosives destroying the outer columns.”
    What you don’t see in THIS video is explosives destroying the outer columns.

    “… some of the elements [Steven Jones] says show that thermate was used could be otherwise explained, such as the presence of sulfer, which would have been found in the sheetrock that made up the interior office walls, etc.”
    It’s not only the presence of sulfur, it’s the combination of sulfur and other elements that lead him to deduce thermate may have been used.

    “Also, thermate is not used for controlled demolitions. One might argue that it COULD be, but how are you even going to attach it to the columns? Whatever you use to hold it there is going to get melted through before the column ever does and there goes your plan. It just doesn’t make sense.”
    Thermite is used for this purpose. Technicians use a device to allow cutting columns at a 45 degree angle at two points. This way they can control lateral motion in the ensuing fall. There are materials which can withstand such temperatures, probably ceramics do. Jones has found what is apparently unspent thermite in his samples, which appears to be corroborated by others. It behaves (ignites) as such:

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4186920967571123147&hl=en

    “Moreover, assuming bombs or thermate devices were in the building, how did they get there? Setting up a building like WTC for controlled demolition would be an absolutely enormous undertaking. One could argue that it could be done, but without anyone noticing?”
    That’s a really tough one. One thing to keep in mind is that a large portion of the time used in preparation for controlled demolition is spent salvaging material to be used/recycled, and on safety. This wouldn’t have been the case here. Admittedly, this still leaves a huge operation, but it doesn’t need to be done all at once. In addition, there are reports of entire floors being closed to the public for months, and of work being done in the elevators months before the date. Controlled demolition in-one-go is not used in buildings this big. One of the videos on this (in 9-11 Research, I believe) suggests that in order to bring down the whole building, it was “cut” into sections by preparing it more thoroughly at the floors closed and elsewhere. I think theories on both sides of the argument are implausible (see below).

    “And you would need a top expert .” [in controlled demolition, presumably]

    Actually, not really. Top experts would probably be people who could ensure the safety of the surroundings and inhabitants. These were probably top experts in destruction (and undercover operations if the hypothesis is correct) who used demolition techniques this time around. But I doubt they could go, say, into business in demolitions successfully. Too messy.

    “If you follow through with the argument that explosives were used, it just begins to get to the point where the plausibility of the thing becomes quite doubtful.”
    I agree that it becomes far-fetched. But the offcial theory is also far-fetched. I looked at a video in the NIST site you mention. One of the experts says that the conditions for such a structural failure and collapse to happen due to fire are extremely rare. And yet, we are to believe that these conditions were met three times in the same day?

    In addition to all this, your article shows eloquently that there are huge conspiracies (in the true sense, without the “wacko” nuance) happening all the time, with many important people involved. Truth can be stranger than fiction.

    While writing this I googled for pictures of the squibs, cut columns etc. Here’s an example:

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3873474711036143711&hl=en

    Here’s a few cues to save you the horror of listening to all that cheesy music:
    [cut column: 8:05; squibs: 7:02, 7:17; thermite residue: 7:46; 45-degree cut: 8:30]

    Surely there is no doubt that those columns with the 45-angle top have been cut. I’ve heard arguments that those had been cut after the event, to transport the pieces away. But cutting at a 45-degree angle takes more time/ material, why would they do that if they have cranes and bulldozers all over the place to help?

    There are engineers on both sides of the argument, see (I’m sure you have, but here for your readers in case they haven’t)

    http://911research.wtc7.net/index.html

    I believe that you’re absolutely right in pointing out that excessive attention to this topic might detract energy from other areas which also need to be addressed, though. And I think you’re right in saying that concentrating on this idea may be counterproductive because those with opposing views can too easily dismiss its advocates as weirdos. There’s probably a “critical mass” past which that will cease to be the case. Maybe. Perhaps alternative topics of importance re: 9/11 should indeed occupy their appropriate place in these discussions. I’m sure they will if people become more familiar with them. So keep writing!

  23. Drew said on September 14th, 2008 at 8:39am #

    911 is the MOST IMPORTANT topic and there is and there is no real attention to these truths let alone “excessive attention.” 911 was the pretext for war, torture, extra-judicial renditions, the Patriot Act, The John Warner Act, the Military Commisions Act, and a whole plethora of freedom destroying programs all in the name of fighting nonexistent terrorists. When you combine the physical evidence that you mention above with the fact that building 7 never got hit by anything yet collapsed just like the other buildings and that eyewitnesses who were in all three buildings heard explosions in the basement of the Towers and on the 8th floor of WTC 7. And that there is video showing the lobby of the towers blown up well before the collapse, and you add to that the total silencing of any meaningful diologue as well as the fact that our president and VP would not testify under oath and wouldn’t have testified at all except the family members wouldn’t let him rest until he did, and you add to that the fact that all the planes disintegrated but the hijackers passports were miraculously found, then you begin to see that the official story is a giant hoax and the reason is so the powers that be can destroy our liberty and fight wars of agression and steal all of the earths resources. Watch “Fabled Enemies” http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2144933190875239407

    to get a better understanding, but don’t EVER EVER EVER minimize this event. It’s implications are huge and the legacy of 911 is more war, less freedom, and tyranny.

  24. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 14th, 2008 at 10:03am #

    Xavier,

    First, let me say that I appreciate being able to discuss such a controversial topic in a reasonable and constructive manner with someone.

    You say load-bearing columns failed far below the point of impact. I’m not quite sure what you mean by this. You can watch the progressive collapse of the towers initiated from the point of impact in pretty much every single video of the event. (This is quite different from the collapse of WTC 7).

    You agree with me that there is no evidence of explosives in the video I linked to showing the buckling of the outer columns at the initiation of the global collapse, but say “there are plenty of examples to be found of videos comparing the ‘squib’ patterns in controlled demolition with (very) similar patterns in the WTC.”

    In a controlled demolition, there are a great many explosive “squibs” that can be seen. Every video I’ve seen of controlled demolitions to compare has shown this. The videos you speak of point to a small handful of puffs of air and debris blowing out of the side of the building very rapidly. But you’ve got to take into account the compression of air resulting from the total collapse occuring above the floors where these “squibs” appear. All that compressed air had to go somewhere. I think if these were “squibs”, we’d see a lot more of them. Also, the prevailing theory is that it was thermate, not RDX type explosives, so this is also a contradiction in the demolitions theory that needs to be reconciled by its proponents.

    You make the point that the collapse must have involved near instantaneous failure in the core columns and not only the outer ones. I’ve noted irrefutable video proof that the outer columns initially failed not from explosives, but from the load. You rightly noted that this might have theoretically been from the failure of the core due to explosives. But the models from NIST’s investigations of WTC 7 show that a progressive collapse initiated by the failure of a single column could result in a very rapid global failure of the core, followed by a virtually simultaneous failure of the perimeter columns.

    I’m with you on being skeptical of the speed of the collapse, but I’m not capable of doing the calculations necessary to dispute the physics based models used. If anyone with the knowledge and skill to do so can do so, believe me, I’m all ears.

    You repeat my statement with different emphasis: “What you don’t see in THIS video is explosives destroying the outer columns.” The implication is that there are other videos showing the destruction of outer columns by explosives.

    I can only presume you are referring to the 3 or 4 “squibs” that can be seen in several videos. First of all, let me make the point by saying that if you don’t believe that the planes destroying a great number of the outer columns could result in their failure, then how do you explain that these limited “explosions”, assuming that’s what they were, resulted in their collapse? The damage from the planes was incomparably more significant than the presumed damage from these limited “squibs”.

    Moreover, the video shows conclusively that the outer columns, rather than being cut with explosives, buckled and failed under the load. That’s irrefutable, and a point worth reiterating.

    On Jones’ argument that thermate was used, I have little to add to what I said previously.

    I noted that Jones’ argument is that thermate was used, but that controlled demolitions don’t use thermate. You said they do. I don’t believe you are correct, and if you want to convince me otherwise, you’ll have to source your claim. A single documented example would be sufficient.

    The link you provides shows Jones saying Iron, Oxygen, Potassium, Aluminum, and Silicon was found in samples of debris. Okay. What does this prove? These are common naturally occuring elements that could easily be explained without having to conclude that thermite (or thermate, he’s not consistent in that) was used.

    On the feasability of planting explosives, I’ll concede that it’s an open question, just as you concede the question of its plausibility is “a really tough one”.

    The destruction of the evidence — I’m sure you’ll agree — was a crime in and of itself, and highly suspicious.

    Yes, when I said you would need top experts, I meant to execute the controlled demolition of one of the tallest skyscrapers in the world. I don’t know why you say this is “not really” so. Controlled demolitions is a highly specialized trade performed by a very limited number of companies with the technical and scientific expertise to be able to safely pull them off.

    You agree with me that “it becomes far-fetched” when one follows through the logic if we assume explosives were used. I similarly agree with you that “the official theory is also far-fetched.” Neither explanation makes full sense to me, which is why I said I’ve been kind of playing devil’s advocate and that I haven’t been convinced one way or the other.

    You said, “In addition to all this, your article shows eloquently that there are huge conspiracies (in the true sense, without the ‘wacko’ nuance) happening all the time, with many important people involved. Truth can be stranger than fiction.”

    I take that as a huge compliment, since demonstrating just that was my intention, so thank you. And point well taken. I of course agree with you.

    Thanks for giving me the time cues for what you want me to see in the second video. I’m quite familiar with this and other such shots of the collapses, and the argument that these are “squibs”, as I addressed above.

    The video also shows the well-known photo of the column that appears to have been cut at an angle. I see this photo all the time, but it could simply be that workers went in and cut this, along with any number of other columns that remained standing after the collapse. You question why they would cut it at an angle, but the answer is the same as the reason they do it that in controlled demolitions — to control the direction of the column as it comes down.

    Yes, I’m familiar with Jim Hoffman’s website, 911research.wtc7.net. He actually links to my website here: http://911research.wtc7.net/resources/web/foreknowlege.html (though that link is outdated and broken and though I emailed him to update it that hasn’t occurred.)

    I appreciate your final paragraph immensely. I think you’ve understood me very well, and I’m happy that you don’t seem to have mistaken any of my points or arguments. I want to reiterate that I don’t think it’s a waste of time — it’s certainly an important topic to investigate — but you are correct that I just think focusing too much on this one issue detracts from other areas, and not isn’t effective at getting through to people who regard the very question as ridiculous conspiracy theorizing.

    To illustrate, you can’t point to mainstream media sources saying explosives brought the buildings down. But there are a hundred other ways to approach the many facets of the crime of 9/11 documented in sources people are willing to lend credence to. For instance, you can point to Dawn, The Times of India, Agence-France Presse, the Guardian, and the Times of London to show people that the allegation that Mahmud Ahmed financed the attacks isn’t a “conspiracy theory”. Etc…

  25. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 14th, 2008 at 8:09pm #

    Drew, nobody is “minimizing” the importance of 9/11. Quite the contrary.

  26. Xavier Fargas said on September 17th, 2008 at 3:27am #

    Jeremy,

    You say,

    “On Jones’ argument that thermate was used, I have little to add to what I said previously.

    I noted that Jones’ argument is that thermate was used, but that controlled demolitions don’t use thermate. You said they do. I don’t believe you are correct, and if you want to convince me otherwise, you’ll have to source your claim. A single documented example would be sufficient.”

    No, I said thermite is used for demolition. Jones talks about this at length. One of the many 911 documentaries, which you’ve probably seen, even has a scene where a demolition expert using thermite to make the 45 degree cuts explains how they make the building “walk” in the direction they want by using this technique. If I find it again I’ll send you the link. But the Jones videos provide examples of thermite use. He suggests that thermate (thermite plus sulfur, potassium permanganate, and other goodies including barium, I think) may have been used for the same purpose. But the thermite use is common and well documented. As you point out though, finding particular element combinations is not necessarily significant. But I’d point out that if you find flakes which are iron oxide on one side and aluminum on the other and which ignite violently (as has Jones, might want to check on the elements/compounds), there’s reason for suspicion.

    Although the engineering calculations for whatever happened inside the building are undoubtedly mind-boggling, the calculations for free fall alone are not difficult. Go to your favorite college physics book and enter the values in the formula for free fall. Then look up “terminal velocity” to take into account air friction. The difference in time must be accounted for by all other resistance. That reduces the question to whether this difference in time is large enough to be believable. I think this is what makes this such salient evidence.

    The part of this theory which I find far-fetched is that the implementation of such a plan would be difficult, not so its connection to the ultimate result if it had indeed been implemented. Jones calculates that it would have taken a small group of men about 10 trips each with 40 pounds of material each to carry enough explosives to do the job. Admittedly, that is only the beginning.

    Regarding the “top experts”, when I said that it isn’t necessarily so that only top experts in controlled demolition could carry this out what I meant was that whoever did this was trained in the destructive part, but probably wasn’t as well-trained in all the safety preparations, which would include all kinds of logistics for say, evacuations. Safety procedures would also include accounting for the ballistics of the flying debris. It would even include climatic variables (such demolitions should not be carried out on overcast days with a low cloud ceiling due to the propagation of the shock wave, for example, and I don’t think 911 would have been called off for bad weather). What I’m getting at is that whoever would have done this could do without half the training an expert in that profession would need for matters beyond destruction. But I’ve no doubt they would be top experts in their profession, which probably had nothing to do with safety.

    “But you’ve got to take into account the compression of air resulting from the total collapse occuring above the floors where these “squibs” appear. All that compressed air had to go somewhere. I think if these were “squibs”, we’d see a lot more of them.”
    The same applies to the compressed air theory, we’d see many more blown out windows. It also doesn’t explain why the compressed air would blow out windows far below the collapse before shattering those closer to it. The “explosives” theory would, because the whole idea is to do away with resistance far in advance.

    “I can only presume you are referring to the 3 or 4 “squibs” that can be seen in several videos. First of all, let me make the point by saying that if you don’t believe that the planes destroying a great number of the outer columns could result in their failure, then how do you explain that these limited “explosions”, assuming that’s what they were, resulted in their collapse? The damage from the planes was incomparably more significant than the presumed damage from these limited “squibs”.”

    That last sentence signifies an assumption that the squibs seen would represent the totality of the explosives used. We don’t know that, and if explosives were indeed used inside the assumption is more tenuous even. Furthermore, even if that is true, a lot of destruction in one place at random is not necessarily more devastating that a little destruction in precisely the right place. Think karate.

    “You say load-bearing columns failed far below the point of impact. I’m not quite sure what you mean by this. You can watch the progressive collapse of the towers initiated from the point of impact in pretty much every single video of the event. (This is quite different from the collapse of WTC 7).”
    What I mean is that you can see the structure collapsing ahead of the demolition “wave”; let’s not take WTC7 out of the hypothesis. And yes, WTC7’s absence of a plane altogether is a big thing. If there was foul play there (there’s a cheesy turn of phrase for ya) it is more likely that the same was the case for the towers.

    “Moreover, the video shows conclusively that the outer columns, rather than being cut with explosives, buckled and failed under the load. That’s irrefutable, and a point worth reiterating.”
    Yes. And I reiterate that that illustrates a consequence, not a cause. Those columns where not what was counteracting the downward force of the building, for the most part. The inner core did that.

    “Also, the prevailing theory is that it was thermate, not RDX type explosives, so this is also a contradiction in the demolitions theory that needs to be reconciled by its proponents.”
    Concentrating on the evidence for the use of one does not exclude the possibility for the other having been used (or similar materials). No one has excluded other explosives, as far as I know. A contradiction would come into being only if the proponents where arguing for the exclusion of such explosives from the equation.

    I went to your website. What is “Yirmeyahu”?

    All best.

  27. Jeremy R. Hammond said on September 17th, 2008 at 3:56am #

    Xavier,

    Excuse my confusing “thermite” with “thermate” in suggesting you said the latter was used in controlled demolitions. “Thermate”, according to Jones, is the military patended formula. Yes, one of the two additives is Barium. I also forget the other.

    When you find the video or other evidence to support your claim that thermite is used or has been used for known demolitions, please let me know. I don’t recall seeing Jones prove this in any of the videos I’ve seen him in.

    I agree with you that the speed of the collapse is compelling. If there’s a “smoking gun” that the buildings were purposely brought down, I’d say that is it.

    Take the recent NIST report on WTC 7. It explains how it might have been possible for a progressive collapse to occur, but does NOT explain how, if that was indeed the case, it occurred so rapidly in WTC 7.

    Go to their website and check out the videos they have showing their computer models of the collapse. There’s an itty-bitty problem. The models look quite like they should for a fire-induced progressive collapse; they look NOTHING like the actual collapse of the building you can see on a number of videos.

    On the “squibs”, I don’t necessarily agree or disagree with you; there’s just too much speculation involved either way, so I don’t really have anything to add. I prefer to stay in the realm of things where so much speculation isn’t involved.

    You said: “What I mean is that you can see the structure collapsing ahead of the demolition “wave””

    I presume you mean you can see the “demolition ‘wave'” ahead of the collapsing structure?

    Yes, the importance of WTC 7 is great indeed. I agree. I just meant that 1 and 2 collapsed from the top down, while 7 went from the bottom.

    On the buckling columns you can see, you say “that ilustrates a consequence, not a cause.” Perhaps. But to say that, you’ve got to prove explosives took out the core.

    “Yirmeyahu” is the Hebrew origin of my name. Yirmeyahu, Jeremiah, Jeremy. See my about page.

  28. Joel said on May 19th, 2009 at 8:48am #

    What complete bull. Bush did the only right thing and the people who did this to us should die for it. You are not a patriot at all. you should support your country

  29. Melidee said on May 26th, 2009 at 11:35am #

    I not only believe, but agree with your article. To add my thoughts, the world trade centers were symbols of the US financial power and to paraphrase the terrorist, “we will not defeat her (USA) through hand to hand combat; we must bring her down thought her financial power.”

    To all the loyal Bush administration followers, we have lost the war on terror, as Americans loss their jobs, homes, life long savings. We have more fear in our hearts now than prior to 9/11. That is a direct result of bad decisions based on lies.

    I said in 2003 Iraq was a mistake for various reasons and I continue with that thought today. I feel sorry for people who are born into a free thinking society and have no power over their on thoughts. The media is not the GOD of information; rather form a way of thinking if you allow it to happen. They certainly let the USA and the world down before and after 9/11 they are suppose to be the defenders of truth, not form believe systems and sway public thought.

    Shame on you who watch CNN, MSNBC, and FOX news and believe they have clear understanding of the world.

  30. Dr. Parker said on August 18th, 2009 at 6:44pm #

    911 was indeed an inside job. More importantly, families of Europe’s aristocracy, who own the stock of the Federal Reserve, are perpetrating a power play against “We the People”; thus, we must disregard our differences and unite around protecting freedom, by investigating this urgent issue and spreading truth. Peer reviewed evidence, books, and credible witnesses are available on http://www.investigate911.org

    This site is the best source of facts that I have found.

  31. alex said on September 17th, 2009 at 12:17pm #

    my uncle died in the crash