President Clinton and Now Obama: Who the Bleep Does Netanyahu Think He Is?

It’s not often that stories about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict make me laugh but one by Jeremy Bowen, the BBC’s Middle East editor, did. Because he is the corporation’s correspondent supporters of Israel right or wrong most love to hate – from time to time they pressure the BBC to fire him – I imagine he enjoyed writing it.

In a vivid background report for From Our Own Correspondent, headlined ‘Tough Lessons for Obama on Mid-East peace,” Jeremy recalled some of the “false dawns” of previous presidential peace efforts.

One was a trip by President Clinton to Gaza in 1998 when Netanyahu was enjoying his first period as Israel’s prime minister. “Yes”, Jeremy added, “an American president in Gaza. It is not conceivable these days.”

After noting that Netanyahu drove Clinton mad, Jeremy went on:

After he (Netanyahu) had lectured the president about the Middle East, Mr. Clinton famously asked his aides: “Who the (bleep) does he think he is? Who’s the bleeping superpower here?” Only he did not say bleep.

What President Clinton actually said was, “Who the fuck does he think he is? Who’s the fucking superpower here?”

After recalling in his own way how President Obama has been humiliated to date by Netanyahu in his second period as prime minister, Jeremy commented that he, Obama, “might be using Bill Clintonesque language about Mr. Netanyahu.”

My own speculation is that Obama behind closed doors might even be outdoing Clinton in his use of expletives about Netanyahu.

But really there’s no cause for laughter. Tears of rage are more appropriate.

The documented truth, which flows through my book Zionism: The Real Enemy of the Jews, is that every occupant of the Oval Office has at one point or another, and as President Ford once put it, been made “as mad as hell” by Israeli prime ministers. So the use of presidential expletives to describe them and Zionist lobby leaders at moments of great tension probably has a history going all the way back to Israel’s unilateral declaration of independence.

Even before that there were moments when President Truman could not contain his anger at the tactics Zionists were employing to bend him and the United Nations to their will. At one cabinet meeting Truman blurted out, “Jesus Christ couldn’t please them when he was here, so how could anyone expect that I would have any luck.”

In Memoirs published long after the events, Truman was very frank about Zionist coercion in the countdown to the General Assembly vote on the partition plan resolution. He wrote:

The facts were that not only were there pressure movements around the United Nations unlike anything that had been seen there before, but the White House too was subjected to a constant barrage. I do not think I ever had as much pressure and propaganda aimed at the White House as I had in this instance. The persistence of a few of the extreme Zionist leaders – actuated by political motives and engaging in political threats – disturbed and annoyed me. Some were even suggesting that we pressure sovereign nations into favourable votes in the General Assembly. I have never approved of the strong imposing their will on the weak whether among men or nations.

As it happened, the campaign of threats to cause a number of sovereign nations to turn their intended “No” to partition votes into “Yes” votes or to abstain was executed by the Zionist lobby with the assistance of a hit-squad of 26 U.S. senators. The whole effort to bend the UN General Assembly to Zionism’s will was co-ordinated by Zionism’s eyes and ears in the White House, David K. Niles. (He once confessed that “had Roosevelt lived, Israel probably would not have become a state.” President Roosevelt was opposed to the creation of a Jewish state in Palestine, and there is a good case for believing, I make it in my book, that if he had lived, he would have used the United Nations to say “No” to Zionism’s colonial enterprise).

When Truman subsequently learned how one sovereign nation in particular, Haiti, had been threatened in his name, he wrote in a memorandum not de-classified until 1971 that “pressure groups (he meant Zionist pressure groups) will succeed in putting the United Nations out of business if this sort of thing is continued.”

Events were to prove Truman more right than wrong on that account.

Eisenhower was the first and the last American President to contain Zionism (when he insisted in 1956/57 that Israel, after its collusion with Britain and France in war on Nasser’s Egypt, should withdraw from occupied Arab territory without conditions).

There is a great deal of evidence to suggest that President Kennedy, if he had been allowed to live, was intending in a second term to continue Eisenhower’s containment of Zionism, and that as a result of doing so there would not have been a shift of U.S. policy in favour of Israel right or wrong. In that event, and in all probability, the 1967 war would not have happened – Greater Israel would not have been created; and the Zionist state would not have been allowed to develop nuclear weapons.

Though it contained no expletives, the most explicit statement of anger I am aware of was the one made by presidential candidate Kennedy after he had been taken to a meeting with Zionist funders in New York. After it, back in Washington, he went for a walk with an old and trusted friend, newspaper columnist Chares L. Bartlett. According to his account, Kennedy said:

As an American citizen I am outraged to have a Zionist group come to me and say – “We know your campaign is in trouble. We’re willing to pay your bills if you let us have control of your Middle East policy. They wanted control!”

In my view the question of who the bleep does Netanyahu think he is misses the point. It is that he knows who he is – another Israeli prime minister who, with the assistance of the Zionist lobby and its stooges in Congress, has got another American president by the testicles. At least for the time being.

Alan Hart has been engaged with events in the Middle East and globally as a researcher, author, and a correspondent for ITN and the BBC. Read other articles by Alan, or visit Alan's website.

65 comments on this article so far ...

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  1. b99 said on November 25th, 2009 at 11:21am #

    I’m reminded of a conversation between Jimmy Carter and Menachem Begin where Carter confessed he’s have trouble getting a peace deal through Congress. Begin told Carter not to worry – that he, Begin, would bring Congress in line. Carter flushed and bristled. But Carter new Begin was right. Congress is Israel’s ‘Amen Corner.’

  2. kalidas said on November 25th, 2009 at 11:29am #

    Some sooner than later, but sooner or later they all receive the 729 bar code stamp. (or else)

  3. b99 said on November 25th, 2009 at 12:29pm #

    Netanyahu just now announced a settlement freeze in the West Bank. His cabinet voted 11 – 2 to freeze settlement building. So now peace talks can begin! Hey, the will and determination of Obama cannnot be denied.

    One glitch. The Jews forgot to include Jerusalem in the settlement freeze. Oh, well – yet another ruse.

  4. Michael Dawson said on November 25th, 2009 at 12:38pm #

    Balderdash. Netanyahu knows exactly who he is — the president of our aircraft carrier and the ringmaster of our cultural dog-and-pony-show in the land of Our Oil.

    The “Zionist lobby” would be exiled to the wilderness if it didn’t serve the empire’s systemic needs.

    Stop making excuses for fuckers like Clinton and Obama.

  5. Van said on November 25th, 2009 at 3:19pm #

    Let’s get one thing straight: Obama was not elected president of Israel. He should stay home and mind his own business. Israeli prime-minister Netanyahu answers to the Israeli electorate, not the U.N. and not the U.S. And don’t give me that old threat that if Israel doesn’t cow-tow to the Washington bureaucrats, we might just cut off their foreign aid. We’re not suppoting Israel because they need us. We support Israel because we need them. Simply put: It’s in the best interest of ‘good ‘ol USA to do so. But you say, “When will the Israelis give up the so-called West Baank and Jerusalem to Hamas and Hesbollah?’ ANSWER: Just as soon as the United States gives back Massachusetts to the Native Americans, and as soon as the United States gives back New Mexico and California to Mexico, from whom we took it by force of arms.

  6. Shabnam said on November 25th, 2009 at 4:02pm #

    The Zionist visitors of this site are going to surpass the regular visitors soon if people continue to engage them back and forth. These terrorist liars have no shame and tell us that Israel acts to satisfy its lust for power which is really “world domination” according to ‘Protocol.”
    They control the WH, senate, Congress, Wall Street and many branches of government. Now, They have targeted Iran because Iran always has been a power in the region, therefore, the Zionist are using American resources through their fifth column in Washington, the Jewish Lobby, to destroy Iran like Iraq in order to dominate the region completely which it is obvious they will take it into their graves, one by one. Israelis are so desperate that they felt the need to send a Zionist liar, pose as a ‘professor’, by the name of Benny Morris around the world to beg the United States to bomb Iran. They have done every dirty trick including pushing for a ‘velvet revolution’ by calling the election ‘fraud.’ All these dirty tricks brought NOTHING BUT SHAME ON THESE WAR CRIMINALS.

    Israel rules BY PROXY.

    People must be united against an apartheid, racist and terrorist entity where has been erected on stolen land of Palestine. You have NO SHAME but arrogance.

  7. B99 said on November 25th, 2009 at 5:28pm #

    Sid – Nazi science.

  8. B99 said on November 25th, 2009 at 5:37pm #

    Michael Dawson – When it comes to Middle East policy, the tail wags the dog. Israel is not the US aircraft carrier. In fact, US fights wars FOR Israel without Israeli contribution to the war effort (save for espionage ‘services’. And in fact, when US invades the region, Israel doesn’t even want the US flying over it.

    Van – Israel is NOT in the best interests of the USA. Israel is a supreme liability. US is Israel’s only ally – but Israel is the ally of no one. We got 9/11 because of Israel.

  9. onecansay said on November 25th, 2009 at 7:42pm #

    Well, any good fund raiser has someone whom asks others to donate in ‘their’ name.

    Washington D.C. has been infiltrated by Zionist elements as far back as the Civil War. Heck, maybe even during the writing of the so called (mortgage document with England) Constitution.

    Wondering for “forty years” in the wilderness brought them finally to this side of the planet. No where else now to go except destroy. This is in “their” history. The Egyptians kicked them out, gladly.

    Their propaganda machine has convinced many that they were the persecuted ones, even to this day.

    So, to be chosen, one has a duty.

    The duty to destroy?

    Most Americans, and for that matter most on this planet do not even have a concept of the EVIL which permeates over them.

    A warm blanket that is doused in “(MID EAST)” gasoline. You are the campfire. They are the ones dancing around!

  10. dino said on November 26th, 2009 at 2:06am #

    I can’t understand about what are “peace talks” between Israel and Palestinians.They are two decisions of UN,242 and 338, which demanded Israel withdrawal inside the borders she held before the war,then in 67.So Israel should to be in peace talk with all the world because she breaches a world decision.And if these decisions will be brought again to UN for a new approval these will be surely approved even without the support of the free world :US Congress,Israel,Sarkozy,Micronesia,The new Papua,isl.Marschall,isl.Bikini.

  11. Rehmat said on November 26th, 2009 at 4:13am #

    American politics revolve around “party interests” and not around the country’s interests. Both Israeli leaders and American leaders understand that. That’s why Tel Aviv can threaten and manupilate th US President, Senate and Congress through its agents among the Jewish lobby groups (AIPAC, ADL, AJC, etc.). The so-called ” freeze on new settlements” or the “release of prisoners” – are nothing but to fool the world and buy more time to weaken Palestinian resistance and annex more Palestinian land.

    Moshe Obama is nothing but a long string of Jewish puppets occupying the White House.

    Obama: The “Promised Messiah”
    http://rehmat1.wordpress.com/2009/11/19/obama-the-promised-messiah/

  12. deceschi said on November 26th, 2009 at 4:18am #

    dinosaur – the Resolution 242 has only then full legal value if and when BOTH main principles are met contemporaneously:

    (i) Withdrawal of Israel armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict;

    (ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgment of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force.”

    In other words: the withdrawal of Israel is interdipendent to the will of ALL Palestinians to recognize Israel in her “territorial integrity and political independence”. This request is still far from being fulfilled by the Palestinians even partially yet. Capisci?

  13. Mary said on November 26th, 2009 at 8:23am #

    Here’s a very cruel man, Bibi’s ultra orthodox emissary. With shame I see they had him at the British Army Officers’ Training college, Sandhurst. (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Efraim_Eitam)

    http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article10914.shtml

    “We will have to kill them all”: Effie Eitam, thug messiah
    Jim Holstun and Irene Morrison, The Electronic Intifada, 25 November 2009

    Colonel Efraim (Fein) Eitam was only following orders when he told his troops to beat Ayyad Aqel in 1988. They beat him to death.

    Eitam, who since then has held several senior posts in the Israeli government, has recently toured the US as Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s “Special Emissary” to the “Caravan for Democracy” program of the Jewish National Fund (JNF). This is a marriage made in heaven. Since Israel was founded, the JNF has organized the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians and the settlement of Jews on their expropriated land; Eitam sees himself as the messianic soldier-prophet directing future expulsions of Palestinians from Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territories.

    Hillel of Buffalo, New York, invited Eitam to speak at our campus, the University at Buffalo (UB), on the recommendation of UB Professor Ernest Sternberg, a board member of Scholars for Peace in the Middle East and a founder of its local campus chapter.
    /……

  14. B99 said on November 26th, 2009 at 8:43am #

    Dino – Indeed, there is no legitimate reason for elaborate ‘peace talks’ between Palestine and Israel. The outlines of the final agreement are known.

    Resolutions 242 and 338 have been repeatedly confirmed by the UN – it was and is still the will of the world. If it were not for the US veto, Israel would be physically removed from its ill-gotten gain like any other sociopathic nation.

    Dizzy – There was no proposal by Olmert. Israel’s duty is to withdraw from Occupied Palestine 100% and that includes East Jerusalem. Palestine is to be 100% independent with all the rights and responsibilities that accompany statehood.

    There is no call in 242 to carry all stipulations simultaneously. 242 is not dependent on Palestinian recognition (which has already been offered as part of the Saudi Peace Offer of 2002), as 242 was passed with regard to the states involved in the war – Israel and its victims Egypt, Jordan, and Syria. All these states accept 242’s provisions and have done so for a minimum of 30 years. The Palestinians are not mentioned in 242, thus for you to say that it requires Palestinians to recognize Israel in her “territorial integrity and political independence” is an obvious lie.

    Why don’t you try the morally uplifting approach instead of shylocking your way through an argument? You know that you are wrong to vanquish a people – so why argue otherwise? Besides, if no moral argument is needed for Israel to stay in Occupied Palestine, then no moral argument is needed for Israel’s demise.

  15. bozh said on November 26th, 2009 at 10:32am #

    I read alan’s piece on ICH. I also posted a comment. But i don’t remember what exactly i said.
    If it is true that truman, clinton, kennedy were mad at and frightened by ‘jewish’ threats and later succumbed to ‘jewish’ demands, then it wld mean that US was or still is a banana empire when it came to US foreign policy.
    The three prezes wld have, obviously, violated US constitution, its governance by making private deals with foreigners.

    A better conclusion wld be, and one based on the fact that US had been expanding for over a century and had engaged in some hundred minor and major wars in order to expand, that the wily pols simply take ‘jewish’ money while US foreign policy remains unchanged: Acquisition of land by any means.

    Actually, all salient facts prove that israel is a near-total dependency on christian world. Isr left on its own cld make cutlery but not tanks, artillery. etc.
    In fact, it wld have never existed had christians suppied land robbers with arms and diplomatic support.
    In short, pols lust for money but uncle sam never wavers, never changes but may make some tactical errors; strategy remaining the same.tnx

  16. Don Hawkins said on November 26th, 2009 at 10:54am #

    Maybe the reason some can’t understand Bozh is because he speaks in a lost language called the truth.

  17. bozh said on November 26th, 2009 at 11:01am #

    Hi don,
    thanks for ur support. Yes, ur comment is excellent! It is OK, don! My wife also doesn’t understand me. Some ‘jews’ understand the gist of what i am imparting.
    The ones that say they don’t stand lies better than the truth. So, in abjection and despair they bark! tnx

  18. Deadbeat said on November 26th, 2009 at 11:05am #

    Actually, all salient facts prove that israel is a near-total dependency on christian world.

    I would not refer to it as a “dependency”. What is clear is that the pro-Israel faction is well organized and have the money and power to push their agenda. What is true is that the Left has spent more time diverting this aspect away from the American public rather than confronting it. They hope through euphemisms or rhetoric such as “War for Oil” they can encourage people to move. The problem is that you cannot move people with dishonesty. Had the Left openly rejected Zionism then perhaps there would be the kind of movement and coalition building necessary to confront Capitalism.

  19. kalidas said on November 26th, 2009 at 11:10am #

    No 729 stamp on bozh.
    This makes him one of the best looking men around.

  20. kalidas said on November 26th, 2009 at 11:12am #

    No 729 stamp on db either.
    Another good looker.

    Too bad this can’t be said for the majority of the “left.”

  21. bozh said on November 26th, 2009 at 2:01pm #

    From the person who finished last in each of his three classes of schooling and an old man of 78 yrs and who dresses and looks like a hobo i got another thing to say.
    U all know that US constitution demands, or is it, commands or wishes [or is just a dumb writ like all the others] that amers pursue happiness, then every amer shld pursue it when-where-why-how s/he wishes.
    For, US constitution, as far as know, doesn’t say why, how,when, where u shld run after the ‘thing’ that realy ain’t a thing anyway but more like a snark, guaranties u the freedom to chose your own why-how of the pursuit of happiness, wealth, health, right to life, etc.
    U do not have to use obama’s how-why; U have a right to choose ur own. And u wld obey the constitution.
    Soldiers cld refuse to go to war and chase after miseries and death. They cld chhose to stay home and guard it and their lives.
    Obviously, if scribes of the constitution were honest, they meant to pursue happiness and right live in US. So that’s where u belong.

    People do not espy that if one does provide whenwhere, how and why, one is selling u pig in a poke. All the verbiage all the writs, includes qoran, bible, and torah without those adverbs is just smoke and mirrors as amers say.
    And when, where, how, why are inseparable in reality. They can be separated from one another only verbally and not situationally.
    The most cunning and dishonest among us cal us stupid solely because people do not espy simplicty of deceit.
    It is so simple that every child as a tabual rasa wld see it in an instant. tnx

  22. Annie Ladysmith said on November 26th, 2009 at 5:06pm #

    Imagine any “superpower” having a sorry, MKUltraed, Asshole like Bill Clinton as it’s president, ARE WE NUTS?? People you are missing the point, Clinton was THE JOKE! Clinton was THE POINT! Foul-mouthed little Asshole should have been impeached!

  23. b99 said on November 27th, 2009 at 8:01am #

    Sid – Palestinians DO indeed exist – the state of Israel finally acknowledged this historical truth – and now ALL Israelis use the term ALL the time. In fact, Palestine and Palestinian are merely Western forms for Philistia and Philistine, as Palestinians were called by Greeks of antiquity. Everyone in Palestine has been Palestinian ever since – even the Jews who lived there (!) before the establishment of The Entity. To boot, there was no such thing as an Israeli until 1948 – a citizenship manufactured out of whole cloth.

    To say that there are 22 Arab Muslim states is like saying there are 20 Latino states in the Americas. So what? Should the Kurds be given Guatemala because Guatemalans should feel at home in Uruguay and the Dominican Republic? A preposterous idea moving Guatemalans to the Dominican Republic and Uruguay, a sane person would think. But somehow the Palestinians should be at home in 22 Arab (and Muslim, even though Palestinians are Christian too) states so those people from Eastern Europe who only really wanted to go to America can replace them. To be truthful – where are Jews most at home? The US of A. where they all wanted to go in the first place.

    So tell me, if there is but one Jewish state, why doesn’t it stay within the borders outlined for it? Why does that Jewish state (a state where one-fifth are not Jewish) jeopardize itself via expansion into the non-Jewish world? It seems there has been a mistake in granting these people a state – they immediately resort to the very race-based notions of citizenship they once decried – and start expanding outside of the domain they have been granted by generous – if guilt-ridden – gentile states.

    Jeez, if only Hitler had been nice about things – he could have said that Germany is an Aryan state and so if Jews don’t like it they could move to any one of several score non-Aryan states. So that’s where Hitler was wrong – instead of merely kicking out Jews he decides to kill them en masse. Well, that does give you moral one-upmanship over Hitler, at least with regard to notions of race and nation. You only want to kill as many as necessary to get the rest to vacate. Hitler, to be sure, was far more blunt about genocide.

    Can’t say I hate Jews, now. Some of my best friends are commie Jews (no J-Streeters, these folks). In fact, I belong to a FREE PALESTINE Org that is chock-full of Jews. Of course, I do have to remind them sometimes that the pursuit of a free Palestine is their solemn duty as Jews – sometimes they do get a bit taken with themselves, an unattractive cultural trait to be sure. (Woe to be a Palestinian in a Jewish State.)

  24. kalidas said on November 27th, 2009 at 8:27am #

    Sometimes…
    That’s a hot one!

  25. dino said on November 27th, 2009 at 1:09pm #

    d. you make me laugh.you took from wikipedia two paragraphs from 242 and you explain that if the first demands the withdrawal of Israel from all territories occupied the second:”Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgment of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force.” connected the implementing of the first with those of the second.But the second paragraph referring also to Israel.What boundaries could Arabs countries recognized when then as today Israel had not boundaries.What the second paragraph marked is the UN refusal to accept annexation of territories by settlement which was the goal of the war and which happened.

  26. Van said on November 27th, 2009 at 2:15pm #

    Talk about “apartheid”: Have any of you visited a Middle East Arab nation lately i.e. Saudi Arabia, for instance? Not one single church allowed and the Christians followed around by the ‘religious police’ lest they corrupt the culture. The only “foreigners” allowed are those who are brought in to act as servants to the nationals. Then, of course, there are the government officials of non-Islamic nations who are kept cloistered away from the populace lest their western ways rub off on the people. And since we’re talking about “apartheid,” how many Jews are allowed to own homes and businesses in Arab countries? How many synagogues can you count in Saudi Arabia? How many non-Islamic people have EVER been successful in obtaining official citizenship in any Islamic nation? Before you call Israel an “apartheid” state, you need to remember that “people who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw rocks.”

  27. B99 said on November 27th, 2009 at 2:26pm #

    Van – There is no glass house. Who pretends Saudi Arabia is a democracy? Saudi Arabia is an authoritarian state – so what do you expect? Israel, however, parades itself as a democracy – yet holds an entire nation under race-based subjugation – the only racialized government in the world.

    Jews DO own businesses in Arab countries. Sadly, Israel long ago put their lives and property in jeopardy making their continued presence in their home countries untenable. Read the Balfour Declaration as to what the establishment of a Jewish homeland was explicitly advised not to do – and then you’ll realize that they did precisely the opposite – they jeopardized Jewish presence in their native lands.

  28. deceschi said on November 27th, 2009 at 2:56pm #

    Which desert are you talking about, there is no desert, neither right nor left of the Jordan River.
    By the way: Israel pulled completely out from Gaza, and the Palestinians, all those extremists who were elected “democratically” by the people, were very fast to turn – not before they killed their own brethren – the entire area under their control in a factory, warehouse and lauching pad at the same time for their little explosive toys of thirty (Qassam 2), seventy (Grad) and ninety kilograms (Qassam 3) each one, to use against Israeli cities. The proof is in the pudding, … and every rational thinking person see it beyond doubt (but of course not deplorable hypocrite Jew-haters like you).

    Dinosaur, resolution 242 doesn’t set the exact boundaries between Israel and Jordan and doesn’t call Israel to withdraw from ALL occupied territories, that means Israel has the legal right to keep some main settlements in a final peace agreement, possibly through a swap of other land (the Olmert’s proposal for instance counted a corridor between Gaza and the West Bank, rejected without alternative by Abbas).
    As for the Jerusalem, it was certainly not the Jews who destroyed the Jewish Holiest City over the centuries – and still heavily bombed in 1948 to massacre and chase away once again their original inhabitants. It was the Arabs.

    The palestinians don’t want to compromise on peace, so they have the settlements. It’s simple. And the windows of opportunities will not remain open for ever.

  29. B99 said on November 27th, 2009 at 4:58pm #

    ALL of them – what are you, dopey? Try the Syrian, Arabian, and the Sinai portion of the Sahara Deserts. What do you think the environment is there – tropical forest?

    As per the UN, and as per anyone who believes in the sanctity of human life – Gaza is still occupied by Israel. Israel did nothing but resettle its Gaza squatters onto the West Bank. Only in the mendacious minds of zionists is Gaza not occupied – so you can get away with that when talking to supremacists like mebozo but not with sane people who follow the news everyday. Israel dropped more tonnage in the first hours of its Gaza massacre than did the Palestinian resistance fire at Israel in ALL the years of occupation. That’s because you come from a culture of racial supremacists.

    242 calls for withdrawal from all of the West Bank and Gaza. Specifically, it calls for ‘withdrawal of Israel armed forces from territories occupied.’ So – show me what part of the territory is not occupied and you can have it. (Of course, you can’t – It’s ALL occupied.) And IT’S THE LAW.

    As for destroying sites – Jews have not shown themselves capable of maintaining religious sites – they destroyed Muslim and Christian sites wantonly in the 47-49 war and deliberately since then. Besides, the only Jews interested in Jerusalem as a holy site migrated there in the 19th century. It was not so important to Ben Gurion and his ilk. The rest of the Jews wanted to go to Williamsburg to make a buck – I think Brooklyn is their true holiest of cities.

  30. B99 said on November 27th, 2009 at 8:33pm #

    Dizzy –
    Lest we get bogged down in the wording of 242 let’s also know this:

    In 1980 the Security Council issued an unconditional call on Israel to withdraw from the Gaza Strip and West Bank. “Reaffirming that acquisition of territory by force is inadmissible,” it referred to “the overriding necessity to end the prolonged occupation of Arab territories by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem.”

    The General Assembly also called for unconditional withdrawal. It said that “the acquisition of territory by force is inadmissible,” and that “Israel must withdraw unconditionally from all the Palestinian and other Arab territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem.”

    The UN Commission on Human Rights characterized the occupation from a human rights perspective as “a fundamental violation of the human rights of the civilian population of the occupied Arab territories.”

    Can’t believe your eyes, Dizzy? Check SC Res 476 of 6/30/80; GA Res 37/123 of 12/22/82; UN Comm on Human Rights Res 1987/2 of 2/19/87.

    It doesn’t get any clearer than that, Diz.

  31. Mary said on November 28th, 2009 at 2:05am #

    I wonder why ‘chocolate’ triggers such a bad reaction in the Zionist mind.

    http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=242966
    Hamas visits 35,000 Gaza homes to deliver Eid chocolate
    Thursday 26/11/2009 (updated) 26/11/2009 21:40

    Gaza – Ma’an – Hamas officials spent the day visiting the homes of 35,000 families in the refugee camps of the central Gaza Strip on the occasion of the first day of the Eid celebrations, project organizers said.

    “We expected no success other than making thousands of Palestinians happy,” organizer Ismail Ad-Derawi said of the chocolate project.

    Chocolate is one of the banned items Israel prohibits from entering the Gaza, and most of the available sweets in the Strip are smuggled in via the southern tunnel system, making it too expensive for average families.

    Locals in the camps said Hamas officials distributed the chocolate to all families regardless of political affiliation.

    Officials declined to comment on the total volume of chocolate distributed.

    and

    Use of “Chocolate Soldier” term in Israel

    In the colloquial Hebrew of Israel, especially as used among soldiers, the term “A Chocolate Soldier” (Hayal Shel Shokolad, חייל של שוקולד) is used to describe a clumsy or spoiled soldier who fails to exhibit militaristic virtues. The term can be used pejoratively or humorously, depending on context. Ruvik Rosenthal, who writes a weekly linguistics column in Maariv newspaper, wrote on the origin of the expression: “The term ‘A Chocolate Soldier’, meaning a soft soldier who is unable to fight, is traced by some to a chocolate candy in the form of a soldier, while others believe it to originate from a play by George Bernard Shaw which has been made into a musical (sic)”

  32. deceschi said on November 28th, 2009 at 5:32am #

    all these resolutions a not worth a penny, as long as Palestinians can’t decide – actually they are not able because prisoners of their own panarab-islamist mindset – to find a unitary policy of peace toward Israel and as long as they break on daily basis your belowed LAW by means of terrorist and warmongering methods (see Hamas & Co.’s and Hezbollah’s continuous rearmament from Iran through Syria).

    One can not help but laugh watching as you desperately and hypocritically appeal to intenational laws, while your pets are shooting under your nose (don’t follow the news every day …? aljazeera and radio islam maybe, hmm?!) hundreds of rockets attacking life of nearly a million civilians.
    It’s funny to see your double-standard-mindset at work, trying to justify the unjustifiable. The withdrawal of Israel from Gaza is the proof in the pudding (in your words), bullshi, too blind to see that?
    I’m for a withdrawal from the West Bank through peace negotiations and a final peace agreement that put a final point at the territorial dispute between the two peoples – not through unpracticable pre-conditions and claims.
    Your obstinate appeals to the international law are nothing but the usual diplomatic trick of the Arabs (passed solely by virtue of their numerical majority) to force Israel to accept conditions that would be equivalent to surrender. This kind of law is ludicrous, bullshi. It is only comparable to the case that in a group of people who spend the night in a hut in the mountains, the majority of heavy smokers decide to send out in the cold the only non-smoker because they want to stay in peace, wrapped in the warmth of their stinking smoke.
    Only terror and war are worse than this kind of fake diplomacy. Or better: this kind of diplomacy is the continuation of the war by other means. It doesn’t surprise me that you drool over it.

  33. Annie Ladysmith said on November 28th, 2009 at 7:46am #

    There is NO land ANYWHERE that wasn’t annexed by the stronger and victorious side. England did it, including Ireland which still haunts this country. The Aussies did it and almost wiped out the OZ Arboriginals, New Zealand did it, America has done it over and over, Russia has done it, Japan tried it,all European countries have done it, China has, people are busy trying it all over Africa, and on and on… if you want to address these issues, fine, but if you want to tell a soverieng nation not to do this and instead practise what you preach and not what you do, you are all hippocrits. To the victors go the spoils, end of story.

  34. B99 said on November 28th, 2009 at 10:48am #

    No Annie – not end of story. There is no longer a doctrine (not that there ever was one) *to the victor go the spoils.* The nations of the world decided in the 20th century that there can be no gain of land through military conquest. On that basis, Iraq was removed from Kuwait and Indonesia from East Timor. The world has repeatedly decided that Israel’s invasion and conquest of what remains of Palestine is also an ill-gotten gain. Thus, the world must work to remove this tumor from Palestinian land.

    So rather than ‘end of story’ what leftists must work for is the rights of indigenous people everywhere – and support the political movements of the subjugated however it manifests itself. In the instance of Palestine, they are a people under a brutal occupation – one wholly supported by the American taxpayer – of which I am one. There is no hypocricy here – just a sense of social justice and plain common sense. What, we should have another 9/11 because Israel-Firsters in the US put our country in the pocket of a pariah nation?

  35. B99 said on November 28th, 2009 at 11:06am #

    So what we have in Palestine is a thread beginning with Herzl’s 19th century call for a Jew State, Ben Gurion’s announcement of a Jew state in all of Palestine, the takeover (and violent eviction of the native population) of 78% of the region in 1948, and the final realization of this goal via Israel’s attack of 1967 – which conquest functioned as a completion of the ’48 war. (So sayeth Itzhak Shamir.)

  36. deceschi said on November 28th, 2009 at 4:24pm #

    You are not convincing at all by using your mendacious wording (”Lebensraum” and so on). You need some mental treatment. Try first with this:
    http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1063817.html

    If it doesn’t help, join your fellows in the rightful holy fight against the “Zionist enemy”, do it now!

    Jerusalem Post
    Oct 30, 2009 18:35 | Updated Oct 31, 2009 2:25
    Gaza: Thousands rally for Islamic Jihad
    By ASSOCIATED PRESS
    GAZA CITY
    Tens of thousands of Islamic Jihad loyalists held a rally in Gaza on Friday to commemorate the group’s slain founder.
    Holding plastic models of rockets and wearing masks and mock suicide bomber’s vests, the members chanted “death to Israel” and “Muhammad’s army will be back to wipe off the Hebrew state.”
    An Islamic Jihad leader, Nafez Azzam, called on the crowd Friday to reject negotiations with Israel and support violent resistance.

    If it doesn’t help yet, go to a doctor.

  37. B99 said on November 29th, 2009 at 12:50pm #

    Diary of a sick mind: Ben Gurion’s Diary 5/24/48: “We will establish a Christian state in Lebanon, the southern border of which will be the Litani River. We will break Transjordan, bomb Amman and destroy its army, and then Syria falls, and if Egypt will still continue to fight – we will bomb Port Said, Alexandria and Cairo.

  38. B99 said on November 29th, 2009 at 12:52pm #

    How Jews won Palestine:

    Massacre at Tantura: On 5/22/48 Jewish terror forces attacked the village at night. The villagers surrendered but the terrorists went on a house-to-house killing spree. Then all Palestinian males between 10 & 50 were taken to a spot near the beach and shot in the back of the head. Remaining Palestinians were forced to dig a mass grave for 230 souls. Then they were marched out by the Jewish terrorists – forever forbidden to return home.

  39. B99 said on November 29th, 2009 at 6:37pm #

    Ben-Gurion said in 1953 that Israel was “in danger of peace.” and that a state of war was necessary to achieve “the fusion of communities” by which he meant the migration of Arab-state Jews to Israel and the settlement of the Palestine Arabs in the Arab states. His reference to the danger of peace indicated his belief that hostilities needed to be maintained so that the Arab states would be suspicious of their Jewish populations, which he hoped would result in their migrating to Israel.
    To keep the pot boiling, Ben Gurion’s IDF launched a raid on the West Bank town of Qibya, killing 66 civilians. Guess who the ‘hero’ of that operation was? Ariel Sharon (may he rest in hell), who mined the homes with bombs and then shot at the doors and windows so that the families would stay inside until the homes blew up.

  40. b99 said on November 30th, 2009 at 7:34am #

    Sidney Reich! Good to hear from you. Some corrections!
    The only time I spend spouting is the time it takes to type it out. I have a long background in issues of self-determination – from South Africa, to Nicaragua, to Palestine – and more. I know the material, and can refute you and most any Zyon at the drop of a hat. No Jew-hating here! Why, I was just over the house of a commie Jew just last night. He’s perplexed; he wants to continue his work in understanding (and fighting) racism in America but understands that there is no greater calling for a Jew than to fight Zionism – a philosophy that has removed Jewry from any cameraderie and commonality with their fellow human travelers on this planet. Oh, those commie Jews – they’re such stalwarts! His call, but I can surely help him with that!

    Yes, and thanks – I do seem to know a lot about Jews. Having been raised in the largest Jewish city in the world, gone to school with Jews, played ball with Jews, dated Jews (if you can call being whisked into bedrooms when the parents are vacationing ‘dates’), having been a Israel-sympathizer until the 1973 War, having done social science work in both Palestine and Israel, and having spent much time over there – hmm, you are indeed correct in stating I know a lot about Jews. You are a very observent boy. You’ll go far!

    As for the psychological help, no thanks – I’m actually really well-adjusted. Maybe the only fear I’ve had (besides high places) is speaking in public – but I’ve long overcome that by doing it repeatedly. Besides, my good psychologist friend – who also happens to be Jooish – thinks I’m the most stable person she knows (admittedly she sees a lot of clients and most of her friends are Jewish – slightly daft or neurotic, if intelligent women). So I’ll have to pass on the psycho-suggestion!

    By the way, I almost never use websites – that’s the stuff of amateurs, mostly. Maybe Wikipedia can provide a date or name – but hey, would you count on them for anything more? No, I’m an avid reader of all the great historians, political scientists, and geographers of the Middle East. Been at it for decades. You ought to try it, instead of linking up with goons, bozos, and ethnocentric nutcases out there in the ether. (I really must recommend Electronic Intifada, however – and must promise myself to read it on a regular basis in the new year.) But back to the real world, maybe you could try a comparative reading of say, Howard Sachar and say, Menachem Begin. So different are their accountings of what went down – Begin’s raw pride in making Palestine safe from gentiles contrasts so sharply with Sachar’s well-scrubbed version of Israel as ‘a light unto the world’. Fascinating stuff!

    Oh, I feel compelled to add that all I post is accurate!

    I should run now – but thanks so much Sidney, for sharing… and most of all…caring. Ciao! … and Mazeltov!

  41. b99 said on December 1st, 2009 at 6:35am #

    Bozo – See how much I know about Jews – you even think I am one! But you can’t say I’m a ‘jew hating jew’ – my Jewish friends just love me, they practically hang on my every word, how could I hate them? Love the sinner, hate the sin (to steal a line from your friends, the rabid right Christians).

  42. Down With Zionism said on December 1st, 2009 at 8:32am #

    b99 you are a jew. You have said it at this site when you were placing your posts under ‘Barry.’ Anyone can go back and find it but of course takes time to go through all posts under ‘Barry.’

  43. b99 said on December 1st, 2009 at 12:50pm #

    Hey Sidney – Calling Jews ‘scum of the earth’ sounds a tad anti-Semitic to me. These buddies of mine are hardworking, do-gooding, people-loving non- and anti-Zionist Jews. It just so happens that they have escaped the tiny confines of the narrow ultra-nationalist paranoia that Zyonists such as yourself exhibit. The assimilated Jew is the happy Jew.

  44. deceschi said on December 1st, 2009 at 2:46pm #

    bullshi – “The assimilated Jew is the happy Jew.”

    Well, in Germany of the Weimar Republic the majority of Jews was assimilated and well-intergrated. But this didn’t help them when the Nazis came to power. Maybe just because of the low-profile stance they took toward their enemies.

    You know, already in the 17th century existed the “Hofjude”, the rich assimilated Jewish servant of the Christian lord. He was rich and powerful but despised by the plain folks. Besides, if he went bancrupt, entire Jewish communities dependent on its service to power, were dragged into disgrace with him.

    I see you seem to delight in the presence of compliant Jews slobbering on you like once the Hofjude toward his master. You said it, bullshi, the best Jew is “assimilated”.

    Unfortunately, there are Jews like me, sid (?), mebosa who don’t play so willingly this role anymore. We are assimilated, polite and hard-working like your nice Jews, but not necessarily compliant or obliging, we don’t deny our origin and the bond to the Jewish state of Israel, and we defend its right to exist. Israel is the realization of the Jewish will to be finally free from magnanimity or oppression of others.
    Maybe that’s why you hate the Israeli Jews so much? All “Zyonists”: “caricature of humans”, as you said above.

    Sorry for my sarcasm, buddy. I interrupted you in your lovely anti-Zionist anti-Israeli rants. Friends again as before 😉

  45. B99 said on December 1st, 2009 at 4:05pm #

    Very very true Dizzy – you finally got something right. The assimilated Jew in Nazi Germany was just as subject to the Nuremberg Laws as was the most shwarts-gekleidet Yiddishkeit putz schlepping die kleinen hintergassen. (Pardon the tri-slanguage combo.)

    Yet, we can’t stop the Jew from assimilating, can we? Just like any other white person in America. Nonetheless, I have to concede, and with no remorse on my part, that my Jooish friends, thoroughly secular they may be, are still aware of being Jewish – and use the positive cultural traits of their Jewish upbringing to good cause. These are hard-working Jews in the best of the Jewish tradition – working for justice without regard to alleged ‘blood’ ties.

    In fact that brings to mind another good friend of mine of the Hebraic persuasion. He’s a postal worker. In his spare time he researches the antecedents of fascism, tracing them back to the Knights of Malta and similar movements of yore. And thence to the recent past in Germany, the post-war transfer of its best and brightest to America – and to the present, the current ruling class of Israel and to great extent, reactionary America. It’s quite an opus. We have classes in his living room.

    Because, after all, the Jew is safe in America – it’s the country that welcomed him, and the Jew is the most successful immigrant in the history of America. Granted, Jews experienced racism and discrimination – but certainly not compared to Africans or Asians or these days, Latinos. Even the early Irish had to deal with more heat in this country for being ignorant Catholic peasants – so we can safely say that what Jews in America had to deal with was akin to a hazing. So the assimilated Jew in America is a happy Jew – he’s safe and free to marry a shiksa.

    Ah – you and sidney and bozo – you guys normally have it easy. All you have to do is raise the specter of anti-Semitism and the goy retreats. And on Israel, the gentile shrugs, he has no dog in that fight, except some confused notions about terrorism and Muslims and the Jews having to endure it, so the gentile concedes the argument to you – nay, he concedes the entire theatre. You get to establish the framework for argument and the terms of discourse. A free ride. But not here! On DV, you can’t get away with the claptrap (at least if I see it), the canards, the really bad history, the anti- Arab racism. On the contrary, here the charge of anti-Semitism is not only well short of shrill, it’s no more than calling someone a schmuck. That’s because you’ve gone to that well too many times. When anti-Semitism used to mean that the Christos accused you of drinking their children’s blood and hanging their messiah, and now it means one criticizes the little jewel – well, the term has degenerated into such much pooh-pooh.

    Hey, don’t get me wrong (for the 19th time) – I’m the one who supports an Israel within pre-67 borders. Of course, its ‘Arab’ citizens and the Palestinian diaspora reserve the right to work toward evolving that state into a democracy – or at least a state of its citizens. And the occupied always reserve the right to resist. And if Israel remains belligerent and something happens to that little jewel before it comes to its senses, what can we say? That the Jews never learn? Oy gevalt, ?that such a thing should happen?!

  46. sid wright said on December 1st, 2009 at 4:08pm #

    b99 The assimilated Jew is the happy Jew.
    you may be happy but very soon the assimilated jew becomes the non jew
    just because you don’t want to be jewish i.e a practising jew doesn’t give you the right to try and stop other jews practising
    you really have some real hang ups
    don’t forget once a jew always a jew
    the anti-semites will still try to get you in the end

  47. deceschi said on December 1st, 2009 at 4:41pm #

    But – in your criticism of Israel you and your so many of your DV-buddies use tipical (postmodern) anti-Semitic wordings. Shall I remind you a couple of examples?
    But above all: how is it that you come to this, folks?

  48. B99 said on December 1st, 2009 at 5:04pm #

    And so what – Israel can commit ethnic cleansing and steal another’s land on a daily basis – and do it with my money, and you guys can lie about it – and then we should talk politely? Fuck that. Deal with a little verbal abuse – you still get to keep your country. Men have learned to deal with verbal abuse from feminists, whites from blacks, and each gets to maintain his privileged position. So buck up.

    ‘Caricature’ – That’s how a Jew of the 19th century described the condition of pre-Enlightenment East European Jewry. The unassimilated Jew. He was making the case for why the Jew was hated.

  49. deceschi said on December 2nd, 2009 at 6:16am #

    I’am assimilated and enlightened, thus neither Dhimmi nor Dummy, as the Israel bashing mainstream from East and West pretty unpolitely seems to expect from me to be passable (but for how long?…).
    Sorry, look for your own caricatural Court Jews.

  50. b99 said on December 2nd, 2009 at 6:55am #

    Well, I think the old Jew hit the nail on the head. That as why the Israeli had to be created out of whole cloth – characterized by the muscular and arrogant Gush Emunim settler with rifle dangling before him. So now the old Arab scurries around like the old Jew used to. I can understand how that has macho appeal for guys like you, but such arrogance will not likely go unpunished for too long. But always the caricature – the Jews just can’t get it right. If only you had kept to your own country.

    In any case, the level of discourse here doesn’t even begin to equate the level of anger – and your level of hurt at the name calling doesn’t even begin to approach the crimes against humanity that you endorse.

  51. deceschi said on December 2nd, 2009 at 8:23am #

    I thought there were good Jews and bad Jews for you … So what now exactly THE “Jews can’t get right”, the fact there are people like you who can’t even discerne the true from the false?

    Nothing to do with arrogance or machism, but what the hell shall we discuss when your moral and political stance is – because of a false tendentious interpretation of the history and modern times – axiomatic and self-righteous beyond any possible post-illuminist dialectic? What shall we discuss about if your belief and intellectual horizon doesn’t go beyond the narrow conceptualism of the 67-borderline, as if this line was a even pale garantee for peace. It’s not just odd, it’s upsidedown99 (hopefully it hurts less).

  52. B99 said on December 2nd, 2009 at 7:36pm #

    Time for another history lesson:

    One aspect of the Nuremberg Laws was that from September 1935 on – only two flags were permitted to be flown in Nazi Germany – the Swastika and the blue and white Zionist banner. Thus Zionism became the only other legal party in the Third Reich.

  53. Mulga Mumblebrain said on December 3rd, 2009 at 12:48am #

    It is amazing what the Chosen People can manage with a mere several billion a year from the US tax-payer and the billions more channelled to the terror state as proceeds from gun-running, blood diamond trade, trafficking in human beings and transplant organs and global financial malfeasance, is it not Sid Vicious? But, Mr Vicious, you forgot to mention those other sewage miracles that the Herrenvolk have visited on the Palestinians. The dumping o fsewage from the illegal settler infestations is well documented, as is the bombing of sewage treatment works in Gaza and Lebanon, and the refusal to allow essential material for their repair into Gaza. But, of course, for racists as cruel and arrogant as the Zionazis, this is simply amusing, isn’t it, Vicious?

  54. mary said on December 3rd, 2009 at 1:37am #

    I think the last but one writer is a worthy candidate to be talking about excrement. Is he one and the same as Mebosa Ritchie? The comment is at the same base level.

    I have just read Charlotte Silver’s moving account about an attempt to prevent the production of a play My Name is Rachel Corrie at Stanford University. She and her friend Amanda Gelender, the play’s producer, remind us that there are American citizens who are prepared to stand up for right.

    http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article10922.shtml
    “My Name is Rachel Corrie” and Israel’s waning impunity
    Charlotte Silver, The Electronic Intifada, 2 December 2009

  55. deceschi said on December 3rd, 2009 at 3:36am #

    bullshi – you deserve more and more the nickname I found expressly for you (upsidedown69 has probably still a too sweet taste). To align a piece of s*** after another seems to be you speciality.
    What you still don’t understand is the fact that even if Israel would withdraw completely behind the 67-borders – what in priciples I agree with – this wouldn’t at all be a garantee for peace. You and your fellows Israel-haters are so one-sided programmed against Israel and, on the other hand, obviously so naiv toward your Palestinian buddies to believe that the latter are not even able to hurt a fly.

    You seem so comfortable in your modern pseudo-leftist myth of the Noble Savage. But reality is always a bit different from our dreams.

  56. b99 said on December 3rd, 2009 at 7:16am #

    dizzy – there are no guarantees of peace. Who has that? Where anywhere in the world is peace guaranteed? Peace is something people and nations must strive for on a constant and rigorous basis – do you think you can demand a peace guarantee because you are Jewish? Do you think that because peace has not been guranteed for Israel you can make life holy hell for your neighbors. Get the fuck out of their country – that’s how you get and give peace. Don’t try to pretend that this is about a guaranteed peace even as you violate every tenet of the Geneva Conventions – even as you more your people onto what little remains of another’s land.

    Noble savage? Speaking of guarantees, I can guarantee I have spent far more time (unless you did an IDF tour of Injun-killing in Palestine) in the WB&G than you have. Palestinians are not holy – but they are a generous and virtually unarmed people and YOU (YOU DECESCHI) are stealing their land and eliminating their culture. That makes you akin to – and as I’ve shown – a spiritual descendent of those who muddied about in the racial lebensraum waters of the mid-nineteeth century Germanic lands.

  57. b99 said on December 3rd, 2009 at 8:13am #

    Mary – I’ve attended productions of “My name is Rachel Corrie” several times in several cities – to some degree in solidarity in as much as American “Israel-First” forces do their level (unlevel?) best to make sure this wonderful – if heartbreaking story sees not the light of day. I’ve attended more than once with a cousin of Rachel. And on a related note, I’ve escorted Rachel’s parents to congressional offices in futile efforts to get our government to investigate Rachel’s murder. It’s all worth it – she’s America’s Anne Frank – but better, Rachel had a political conscience.

    Thanks much

  58. B99 said on December 3rd, 2009 at 4:52pm #

    EVERYBODY I know in Europe understands that Israel is the problem child, that as horrific as terrorism is, it does not let Israel off the hook for its barbarism – that its a charade for Israelis to cry wolf, blame the terrorists as it operates its 19th century brand of racial politics and ultranationalist ideology.

    Israelis have no problem but their own inadequately developed sense of humanity – or should we say warped sense of their own importance. Basically, Europeans understand that if Israel kept to itself, reactionary Islam would self-contain. A whole lot of Europeans were proud that Hazballa won that war. They thought it would teach the Jews a lesson. But as always, they absorbed the wrong lesson.

  59. B99 said on December 3rd, 2009 at 4:53pm #

    History!!

    Some 60% of all capital invested in Palestine from 1933-39 was channeled thru agreements with the Nazis. As part of the deal the World Zionist Organization began soliciting customers for Germany. Eventually the Zionists began exporting Palestinian oranges to Belgium and Holland using Nazi ships – and by 1936 began selling Hitler’s goods in Britain.

  60. deceschi said on December 3rd, 2009 at 5:09pm #

    No man, Israel lives under barbarians since her birth and can not help but to be a strong nation. Jews have always been and are still poets, artists, scientists and intellectuals – first the horrors of the Nazis, than the Arabs forced them to be soldiers in their homeland in order to survive. But how can you understand this, you ignoramus (lacking in wisdom and saneness) par excellence.

  61. B99 said on December 3rd, 2009 at 6:39pm #

    No doubt Dizzy, Jews have been all those things you name – and more – much more!! Ha! But you lost the battle to the Germans, so you take it out on the Palestinians. Like we both well understand – the Palestinians did not go to the Stetls, you went to their country and shot them into ditches. They are native, you are not – in this way you created your own problem. But that is the way of the Jews, brilliant but fatally flawed.

  62. deceschi said on December 3rd, 2009 at 7:22pm #

    Well, bullshi, on which land are you sitting on, you that you even haven’t any kind of roots or ancestors or history there were you live, but you are the product and the child of colonialism pure which uprooted and exterminated entire native Indian populations? Shall I say: but that’s the way of the Christians – greedy for new land and resourses (“Lebensraum”) that not belong to you, BUT double-standard hypocritical enough not to admit it? Clean record?
    And why so desirous to blame Israel, the state of the Jews, but blind for the faults of others (let alone of the Palestinians and Arabs)?
    So what is your problem with the Jews in particular? Do you see it? Do you see your sick anti-Semitism?

    Who was your father, who were your parents, bullshi?

  63. B99 said on December 3rd, 2009 at 8:11pm #

    Yes, dizzy, I support the struggles and efforts of Native-Americans. Precisely the same policy I have as toward Israel. US now exists and you can’t send anyone ‘back’ anywhere. Indeed, Manifest Destiny is a variation on lebensraum – maybe even a model for it and Erez Israel.
    It’s safe to say that Americans – at least politically conscious ones – have long come to terms with this country’s tawdry history, maybe for three decades now. No one can do movies anymore where Indians terrorize whites, rape their women, scalp the men, and talk like automatons. It’s only Israelis that have not come to term with THEIR history – and until you do, you guys are seriously subpar as neighbors and citizens.
    I don’t only blame Israel, I blame the “Israel-Firsters’ in my country, and the stupid goyim who run scared when a Jew with clout shows up. I blame US policy makers for spurning the good people of the Middle East for this little tyranny. We paid for this with 9/11. Why shouldn’t I blame Israel? Who else runs an Apartheid regime in stolen land? What other country illegally occupies another? What other country have we poured more than a hundred billion dollars into so it can commit genocide on the native natural people of that land? And with my money and our money.

    No anti-Semitism here! Some of my easiest girlfriends have been Semites. Just an accurate depiction of what you are up to – lying sack of shit. You see, you KNOW you’re getting the rest of Palestine the way the US got this continent. And you want it so bad you’ve lost all connection to decency, to humanity, to civilization.

    My parents? New Yorkers.

  64. B99 said on December 3rd, 2009 at 8:23pm #

    The Public Committee Against Torture in Israel (PCATI) released today [2 December 2009] a new report which exposes the shifts in Israel’s combat doctrine as evidenced in the prosecution of operation “Cast Lead” and from numerous public oral and written statements made by high ranking military officers and senior Israeli government officials.
    The report, “No Second Thoughts: Changes in the IDF’s Combat Doctrine In Light Of Operation ‘Cast Lead’,” demonstrates Israel’s application of a new combat doctrine during the hostilities in Gaza, which is based on two principles:
    “Zero Casualties”: The complete prioritization of avoiding IDF [Israeli army] casualties while disregarding the increased risk to Palestinian civilians. The implementation of this policy is evident in the massive use of fire power, the use of white phosphorous weapons in densely populated areas, and in firing at Palestinians in the streets, with no discrimination between combatants and civilians, this even after the IDF would order the evacuation of residents from civilian homes.
    “Dahiyah Doctrine”: named after the residential Dahiyah district in Beirut, where Hizballah enjoyed support and also had its headquarters. The district was massively bombed by the IDF during the Second Lebanon War. The doctrine promotes targeting civilian infrastructure in order to cause widespread destruction and suffering among the civilian population so as to foment popular opposition to Israel’s opponents (namely Hamas and Hizballah).
    As a result of the implementation of these principles, the fighting in the Gaza Strip caused intentional and large-scale damage to civilian infrastructure as well as the killing of hundreds of non-combatant civilians (despite the absence of an official policy to intentionally kill civilians). Israel’s actions directly contradict official statements claiming that the IDF acted in accordance with international humanitarian law and took every possible measure to avoid harming non-militant civilians.
    This combat doctrine morally stains the citizens of Israel. It may lead to increased international isolation of Israel and to a situation where Israeli soldiers, officers and leaders will face arrest outside of Israel and be charged with war crimes. The writers of the report summarize: “So fundamental a shift in the IDF’s combat doctrine, which has such a far-reaching impact, shouldn’t be considered only in the closed forums of the General Headquarters and the Security Cabinet, but demands substantial public discussion.”

  65. jon s said on December 3rd, 2009 at 10:39pm #

    An Appeal

    I’ve contributed to DV from time to time, mainly from a Left-Zionist perspective. Lately I’ve stayed away from posting here, both for personal reasons ( I have a life ,after all…) , but also because of the deterioration in the “discussion” to childish name-calling and personal attacks.
    I think that differences can be expressed forcefully –even vehemently – while maintaining a courteous and civil tone.
    Let’s call each other by the names we chose to write under, let’s show some mutual respect, let’s have a sane and rational discussion.
    What do you all say?