The Torpedo that Hit the USS Liberty: Made in the USA?

On October 2, 2007, John Crewdson, Chicago Tribune Senior correspondent reported that, “Bryce Lockwood, Marine staff sergeant, Russian-language expert, recipient of the Silver Star for heroism, ordained Baptist minister, is shouting into the phone.

“I’m angry! I’m seething with anger! Forty years, and I’m seething with anger!”1

When I spoke with Ol’ Sarge Bryce from his beef cattle farm in Missouri on the phone November 10, 2007 he was not only still seething and shouting, he also broke down and cried as he recalled that day in infamy on June 8, 1967 when the Johnson Administration colluded with the state of Israel in a treasonous cover-up of the attack on the USS Liberty, an Intelligence gathering [spy ship] vessel, barely armed with just four .50-calibre machine guns, sailing in international waters, flying the American flag during the Six Day War.

But, it was not until the evening of Sept. 26, 2006, that Ol’ Sarge Bryce publicly opened up after bottling up his experiences of June 8, 1967.

On that night, former CIA analyst for 27 years, Ray McGovern, “gave a talk on Iraq to an overflow crowd of 400 at National Avenue Christian Church in Springfield, Missouri… [regarding the Israel Lobby and its power] over our government and Congress. In sum, in June 1967, after deliberately using fighter-bombers and torpedo boats to attack the USS Liberty for over two hours in an attempt to sink it and kill its entire crew, and then getting the U.S. government, the Navy, and the Congress to cover up what happened, the Israeli government learned that it could-literally-get away with murder.”2

McGovern faced 400 blank stares and asked how many in the crowd had ever heard of the USS Liberty and three hands went up.

McGovern called on the man closest to him and “ramrod straight he stood:” Sir, Sergeant Bryce Lockwood, United States Marine Corps, retired. I am a member of the USS Liberty crew, Sir; I have not been able to [speak about the attack]. But it has been almost 40 years, and I would like to try this evening, Sir.”3

Bryce Lockwood, a descendant of Mayflower pilgrims was a Russian linguist and Staff Sergeant Marine on a special mission on the Liberty assigned to collect communications intelligence aboard a most easily identifiable ship, for it was 455 feet long and festooned with radio aerials.

Ol’ Sarge Bryce informed me that, “Admiral Tom Moorer, a former Chairman of the Joint Chief of Staffs stated that the Liberty was the most identifiable ship in the US Navy. He thought it was the ugliest ship in the Navy, but I thought it was pretty!”

Lockwood choked up frequently as he recalled the events of June 8, 1967 and the post traumatic stress he has endured for forty years, “Ten feet from where I stood that torpedo that may have been made in the USA hit us and twenty five Americans died immediately…

“Before the attack, some sailor had gotten blank teletype paper and made a four by six foot Israeli flag and using a blue felt tipped marker he had drawn the Star of David on it. That torpedo struck only a few feet from it. That torpedo that may have been made in the USA hit a main brace and absorbed the energy. If that torpedo had hit six inches to the left or the right of that brace, the Liberty would have split in two!”

This reporter’s fact checker, Ken Halliwell, a former US Navy Communications Technician, was honorably discharged in 1974 as a Petty Officer First Class, after serving six years in the Naval Security Group. Ken wrote in an email to me on November 11, 2007, “The torpedo did not directly strike the hull on the deck where he [Lockwood] was located. It hit the hull on the deck below him and opened a large hole in the hull on his deck, during its explosion. See my research at: http://usslibertyinquiry.googlepages.com/essay4. Regardless, it doesn’t change the fact that a torpedo hit the ship, and made a large hole in the hull on Bryce’s deck.”

On the phone, Ol’ Sarge Bryce admitted, “My first thought was: I guess this is it God! I am coming home! But at least my kids and Lois will be taken care of. I would never deny that it was God that kept the Liberty afloat!

“I could have saved myself, but it was Phil Tourney who saved me and an unconscious man I had been trying to save. It was Phil who opened the scuttle hole to check how badly the ship was hurt and I was on the other side. I had been trying to carry an unconscious man up the ladder and every time I got to the top of the ladder I dropped him. The only light I had was coming through the torpedo hole, a torpedo that may have been made in the USA.

“Nobody can actually prove that torpedo was or wasn’t made in the USA, but my understanding is that America sold WWII surplus torpedoes to Italy and Italy sold those torpedoes to Israel.

“You also need to understand that the sea has natural rolls, and every time the ship rolled water gushed in and out of that torpedo hole, a 36 X 24 foot hole, the size of a small American home!

“I dropped this guy four times trying to get up the ladder; every time I dropped him I could see him being sucked out of that torpedo hole; a torpedo that may have been made in the USA!

“I was so angry, the hatch was sealed shut and I was pounding on it for help. Phil broke regulations for he didn’t have clearance to be there, but he saved our lives. There was so much confusion, I passed out for a while and when I came to I was told I saved the lives of three men, but I only remember two.”

Lockwood wailed and needlessly apologized for crying while he informed me, “Both my Arabic linguists, Sergeant Jack Raper and Corporal Eddie Rehmeyer were killed…After the 25th Reunion of the Liberty Vets I was sitting in a truck stop in Cabool, Missouri. I am wearing a Liberty t-shirt and this lady comes up to me and asks if I was from Norfolk, where the Liberty had been docked. She tells me she had been Gary Blanchard’s fiancée… Gary was sitting in a boatswain’s chair chipping and painting when the jets struck and riddled his kidneys with shrapnel…Dr. Keifer sedated him as he told him, ‘Gary, it doesn’t look good, but if I don’t you won’t’…Gary never woke up…”

I let Lockwood catch his breath and composure for a few minutes before I inquired what he had been told his mission was and if there had been any Hebrew linguists aboard.

He replied that Lt. Commander David Ed Lewis, the officer in charge of 194 men out of the total crew of 294 on the Liberty, “Called Raper, Rehmeyer and me together and told us that our mission was to keep track of all the Russian and United Arab Republic’s communications. He said if we picked up any Israeli communications to note it and drop it…I am not saying there weren’t any Hebrew linguists aboard and I certainly was in a position to know about it, but I had no knowledge of any…

“An English reporter, I think his name is Trevor Penick, he worked for Thames Television in London and when he interviewed Moshe Dayan he questioned him about the Liberty and American Congress. Dayan said something like, ‘Forget about Congress. We own Congress.'”

See previous part: Remembering the USS Liberty.

LEARN MORE:

USS Liberty-Inquiry
USS Liberty

  1. Baltimore Sun []
  2. Consortium News []
  3. Ibid. []
Eileen Fleming is the author of Keep Hope Alive and Memoirs of a Nice Irish American Girl's' Life in Occupied Territory and the producer of 30 Minutes With Vanunu. Email her at ecumei@gmail.com. Read other articles by Eileen, or visit Eileen's website.

43 comments on this article so far ...

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  1. joed said on November 17th, 2007 at 6:35pm #

    Thanks for the fine article Ms. Fleming. What exactly is your point here?

  2. Eileen Fleming said on November 18th, 2007 at 7:22am #

    My point is to honor the LIBERTY VETS and support my troops by listening to what they experienced, writing it down and disseminating it on the www.

    The fourth in this series is on its way and my hope is that JUSTICE will one day be served and the LIBERTY VETS will get what they have been seeking:

    An open, independent investigation with a declassification of all records about that day in infamy when Israel got away with murder.

    e

  3. Neal said on November 18th, 2007 at 6:02pm #

    Ms. Fleming,

    If, as you claim, we do not know all of the facts – or even most of them -, how can you assert that Israel got away with murder? You are, frankly, way out in front of the facts – and by your own admission. Otherwise, why do we need an investigation?

    In any event, the most apparent fact involved here is the existence of a total war. In such wars, ships get sunk that probably should not be sunk. That is terrible but it is not unusual. Again, in total war, a lot of bad accidents occur; in fact, a lot of bad accidents occur in ways that seem rather deliberate.

    You might recall that the US has done similar things to neutral ships in wartime, mistakenly sinking such ships. The attacks, to those harmed, seemed very deliberate. But, they were normally the result of mistakes – the very kind that are the norm of war. Such, in all likelihood, is what is involved with the Liberty.

    By way of an example out of American history, the US, not even in wartime, knocked down a commercial airline of Iran. It was a time of high tension. Yet, no one throws around the term “murder” unless there was a conscious decision to commit murder.

    I suggest you step back a bit and consider that your bias against Israel has you assuming things that are rather unlikely to be so. Which is to say, you are seeing facts in a way that make them seem to fit your theory. Given the existence of a total war, the chances are – as in 99% chance – that what occurred was a horrible mistake, not a murderous attack.

  4. Deadbeat said on November 18th, 2007 at 6:19pm #

    If, as you claim, we do not know all of the facts – or even most of them -, how can you assert that Israel got away with murder? You are, frankly, way out in front of the facts – and by your own admission. Otherwise, why do we need an investigation?

    You just made a strawman argument. Ms. Fleming never claim that she is unaware of the facts. In fact here article is an attempt to draw out the facts and present the facts. It is justice that she wants and demands.

  5. jaime said on November 18th, 2007 at 6:34pm #

    The Liberty incident was a tragic accident. Tragic accidents happen in wartime. It’s been thoroughly documented and investigated.

    This is just flogging a dead horse.

  6. Eileen Fleming said on November 18th, 2007 at 7:48pm #

    Thanks for all the input, and am most grateful for what you wrote ‘Deadbeat!’

    Dear Jamie and Neal,

    First off, my main issue is the USA government cover-up and callous and reckless disregard for our Veterans.

    In checking the Congressional Record you will see the only investigation was the original Naval Court of Inquiry.

    The Liberty Veterans Association has offered $10,000 reward to anyone who can prove there was ever a Congressional investigation and so far, no takers!

    The Naval Court of Inquiry was done by two officers under the command of Senator John McCain, Sr. and it was concluded in six days.

    Stick with my series-for I have only just begun- and I will illuminate that parts of that ONLY investigation were altered, excised out, and falsified with intent.

    thanks for your interest and all input,

    e

  7. James Ennes said on November 18th, 2007 at 8:24pm #

    The attack on our ship was planned, deliberrate, calculated murder. It is publicly recognized as such by nearly ever senior US government official who has ever looked into it. Anyone who views their accounts at http://www.ussliberty.org/supporters.htm or http://www.ussliberty.com with an open mind will agree.

    James Ennes
    survivor
    author of Assault on the Liberty

  8. don adams said on November 18th, 2007 at 8:24pm #

    To Neal:

    Since you accuse other of unreasonable anti-Israel bias, I must conclude that you have a pro-Israel bias. What arrogance. As Reagan said “here you go again” everyone that says anything negative about Israel is an anti-Semite and “biased” against Israel.

    Neal, you should go to the Liberty website and read the broad range of comments from honest and patriotic Americans.

    And, about the facts, how can anyone including you, possible believe the Israeli alibi that they thought the Liberty was an Egytian horse carrier, about one tenth the size of the Liberty traveling at about one tenth of the Liberty’s speed? This Neal, from you beloved and wonderful Israel with their brilliant and talented military and intelligence organizations.

    Which is it Neal? Are the IDF and Israeli intelligence incompetent and almost blind, or are they lying through their teeth.

    It is a disgrace to charge the types of things you have charged against the brave, heroic survivors of the Liberty. Shame.

    With disgust to you,

    Don Adams

  9. James Ennes said on November 18th, 2007 at 8:37pm #

    Investigated? The only so-called “investigation” has been refuted in writing both by the court’s own legal counsel and by the legal counsel to the convening authority. The signed statements can be found in http://www.ussliberty.org. A Florida hack does appear frequently on CNN to claim that multiple “investigations” have exonerated Israel, but that is a bald lie. We survivors have long offered a $10,000 reward to anyone who can show that there has been even one Congressional Investigation. There has not. You can read all about that false claim and the liar who makes it at http://www.ussliberty.org/whoiscristol.htm.

    James Ennes
    Survivor

  10. James Ennes said on November 18th, 2007 at 8:41pm #

    Corrected link:
    http://www.ussliberty.org/summary.htm

    (A period was appended by the software.)

  11. greybeard said on November 18th, 2007 at 9:24pm #

    When the need is strong enough, black can be imagined to be white, and 2 + 2 can equal 5. I don’t know which is more deplorable–the intentional attack on an “ally” or the American cover-up–or the need to believe in the “purity of arms” of Israel. Let’s hold our myths tightly, lest the ugly truth slip past our defenses.

  12. Glenn Oliphant said on November 18th, 2007 at 9:26pm #

    If you click on the Baltimore Sun Article above you will learn the truth of what happened to the USS Liberty. People always ask why would Israel do that and here is another possible reason. In 1956, President Eisenhower made Israel give back land they had grabbed from Arabs and they were mad about that and then around 10 am on the morning of the attack on the Liberty the US State Dept sent a telegram to Israel that the US was aware that Israel was preparing to attack the West Bank and Syria and the US wanted them to stop and abide by a cease fire they had agreed upon. Israel was not going to let the US stop them again and they decided to create a little distraction, namely attack and sink the Liberty. Traitor Johnson let them get away with murder when he knew the truth.

  13. Survivor 67 said on November 19th, 2007 at 12:37am #

    Wish I had a nickel for every comment such as the one jamie submitted.
    Like a broken record. “There are always accidents in the fog of war”,
    just to name one. This type of comment is usually made by one who
    hasn’t taken the time to read the facts, nor wants to. Just to point
    to one very important fact that many don’t know. Practically every
    person who held any office of responsibility during that era has said
    publically that this was no accident. Could they all be wrong? Take
    the time to go to http://www.ussliberty.org and check it out.

  14. Eileen Fleming said on November 19th, 2007 at 2:41pm #

    First off, I have NO hate for any people and in fact i LOVE what Israel’s very own Declaration of the establishment stated in 1948:

    “On the day of the termination of the British mandate and on the strength of the United Nations General Assembly declare The State of Israel will be based on freedom, justice and peace as envisaged by the prophets of Israel: it will ensure complete equality of social and political rights to all its inhabitants irrespective of religion it will guarantee freedom of religion [and] conscience and will be faithful to the Charter of the United Nations.”

    I LOVE the Hebrew prophets who ROSE UP and reminded the ‘stiff necked people’ what God required:

    “What does God require? He has told you o’man!
    Be just, be merciful, and walk humbly with your Lord.” -Micah 6:8

    The apartheid state and military occupiers we call Israel has not listened to its prophets or honored its own words.

    The apartheid state and military occupiers we call Israel has been aided and abetted by OVER 100 BILLION USA TAX DOLLARS

    [learn more: http://www.ifamericansknew.org/ ]

    And a supine Congress and untrustworthy presidents have complied with their BLIND allegiance to allow the apartheid state and military occupiers we call Israel to become one of the biggest bully’s in the world.

    What I do hate is hypocrisy and any ideology that proclaims any people, race, religion more superior and deserving of special treatment at the expense of the least among us.

    What I do LOVE is what the Torah commanded:

    “From Moses to Jeremiah and Isaiah, the Prophets taught…that the Jewish claim on the land of Israel was totally contingent on the moral and spiritual life of the Jews who lived there, and that the land would, as the Torah tells us, ‘vomit you out’ if people did not live according to the highest moral vision of Torah. Over and over again, the Torah repeated its most frequently stated mitzvah [command]:

    “When you enter your land, do not oppress the stranger; the other, the one who is an outsider of your society, the powerless one and then not only ‘you shall love your neighbor as yourself’ but also ‘you shall love the other.'” -Rabbi Lerner, TIKKUN Magazine, page 35, Sept./Oct. 2007

    What I hope and pray is that Americans will WAKE UP and regain COMMON SENSE!

    “Soon after I had published the pamphlet “Common Sense” [on Feb. 14, 1776] in America, I saw the exceeding probability that a revolution in the system of government would be followed by a revolution in the system of religion… The world is my country, all mankind are my brethren, and to do good is my religion.”-Tom Paine

    What I do believe is that by demanding JUSTICE for the USS LIBERTY Vets we the people will take back our country!

    e

  15. Dan said on November 19th, 2007 at 3:43pm #

    Anyone that has considered ALL the evidence presented can plainly see that there is a MOUNTAIN of evidence, both anecdotal and circumstantial, as well as a large amount of inculpatory statements by the Israelis, that PROVE BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT the attack was deliberate. Thus, it was the MURDER of 34 americans!! May I suggest to anyone who cannot see this to reexamine their thoughts about being an American. To purposely ignore the FACTS of this is tantamount to TREASON!!!!

  16. James Ennes said on November 19th, 2007 at 4:10pm #

    Jaime tells us that Liberty survivors have been “compensated”. Really? How are men “compensated” for permanent disabilities or PTSD? How are mothers and widows compensated for loss of them sons and husband’s? How are crewmen compensated for the loss of friends. How are we compensated for 40 years of lies?

    All we ask is for the murderers to stop lying or for our own government to take our testimony publicly under oath.

    Is that too much to ask?

    Jim Ennes
    Survivor

  17. Eileen Fleming said on November 19th, 2007 at 5:23pm #

    More on Compensation:

    So far, I have only spoken with six Liberty Vets and the more I hear, read and learn the MADDER I get!

    These men, who put their ass on the line to protect we the people have been royally screwed-pardon my French-by the reckless disregard for their life and mental health because LBJ didn’t want “to embarrass an ally.”

    My Irish is flaming and what i want to do is EMBARRASS all the politicians who yack yack yack about supporting our troops and honoring our vets but haven’t done jack when it comes to doing the right thing, the moral and ethical thing which is all the Liberty Vets have been asking for:

    An open, independent investigation and declassification of 40 year old records regarding that day in infamy when the MSM went MIA and Congress went supine!

  18. jaime said on November 19th, 2007 at 6:40pm #

    Well, Eileen, you can save “your Irish.”

    Congress is not going to reopen the case, and Israel is not an “apartheid” regime. If you want to experience one of those, go visit Saudi Arabia.

    And Mr. Ennis, if you’ll re-read my post it said “Compensated or not compensated.”

  19. James Ennes said on November 19th, 2007 at 8:21pm #

    You did. You wrote:

    “Congress is not about to reopen the books on the 40 year old incident. The veterans have been compensated (or not compensated) just like pthose of any other conflict the US has been in for the last 100 years. It’s just considered mishap through friendly fire during a shooting war.”

    And then you went on to attribute it all to “friendly fire” and to the rantings of “white supremacists”. Not so. It is the legitimate concerns of American veterans for their shipmates who were deliberate murdered by a so-called “ally” who has been lobbying ever since to keep the whole story out of the public eye.

    You seem be suggesting that we should overlook the murder of our friends because it was all forty years ago. I don’t see anyone overlooking the Haulocaust or any other historical outrage just because a few years have passed and a few tears have been shed. The murderers are still guilty and should be exposed, if not prosecuted.

    Jim Ennes

  20. jaime said on November 19th, 2007 at 8:36pm #

    Just that this thing’s looking like some kind of 40 year old wild goose chase and Israel hate fest. I mean, really….what kind of redress would you realistically expect at this time? Do you think it would be revisited before, say, The Bay of Pigs incident, or the mining of Haiphong harbor?

    Wait, let me guess….that the USA disassociate from Israel…right?
    Or let’s take it one step further, now that Eileen’s decided that

    “..The apartheid state and military occupiers we call Israel has not listened to its prophets or honored its own words…”

    I’m sure she means babies, children, old people, everyone.

    Maybe disassociation isn’t strong enough. Maybe it’s about “cleansing”
    the area of 7 million people.

    That suit you?

  21. Neal said on November 19th, 2007 at 10:01pm #

    Deadbeat,

    If the facts are known, why is an investigation needed? That makes no sense. We either know or we do not know.

    Now, I think we know sufficient facts and do not need an investigation. The sufficient facts to know are that there was a war and in war, bad stuff happens. And, to those non-combatants harmed, it normally seems deliberate.

    In this case, our country had its ship pretty close to a war. As has happened may times in the past, being near a war is a dangerous thing.

    Ms. Fleming,

    There was nothing to cover up. This is not a complicated matter. It was a war and the ship was near the war zone. In war, bad stuff happens.

    don adams,

    I accuse some people of unreasonable bias. I certainly accuse anyone who thinks an incident from 40 years ago, which was quite obviously a tragic mistake, was a deliberate attack that needs to be publicized of being biased. And, a person who needs to say she loves everyone including the Hebrew prophets holds strong biases.

    I shall answer your question about the military being blind this way: was our government blind when it shot down an Iranian airline that was plainly marked as a civilian plane? Obviously not. It was a tragic mistake made in a tense situation. Similarly, the Israelis were not only in a tense situation but in a total war. In such situations, the tendency is to err on the side of eliminating any conceivable threat.

  22. Phillip Tourney said on November 19th, 2007 at 10:51pm #

    To all thank you for your thoughts on USS Liberty.
    I am a Survivor of the murder of my mates June 8 67. I saw it with my on eyes. Israel new who we where and did it any way.
    What a bunch of low life bastards they are. It is a fact no getting around it. I will tell you what you will get TEN TOUSAND DOLLARS if you can prove it was a mistake. Free money if you can come up with the goods. But you but licking cowards can”t can you?.Lay off of Eileen all she is doing is telling the truth she has the truth on her side alond with the USS Liberty Veterans.
    Phillip F Tourney
    Survivor
    .

  23. Ken said on November 20th, 2007 at 4:08am #

    Jaime and Neal, If the attack was purely a mistake — as you both claim — and the IDF has nothing to hide, then why did the IDF feel it was necessary to proffer fake gun camera photos (i.e., fraudlent evidence) in its History Report about the attack?

    For reference, see the following:
    http://usslibertyinquiry.googlepages.com/essay7
    http://usslibertyinquiry.googlepages.com/essay11
    http://usslibertyinquiry.googlepages.com/essay12
    http://usslibertyinquiry.googlepages.com/essay13

  24. John Hrankowski said on November 20th, 2007 at 6:18am #

    As a Survivor of the USS Liberty attack, I must say that it was a deliberate attack on the ship. Only Israel knows the reason it hit us and with out any investigations we will never find out the answers. As for investigations on the American side there was only one flawed Naval Inquire. Go ask the Library of Congress to pull any of the investigations that Congress did on the USS Liberty attack. When you do you’ll come up with none, because there was never any . BTW as for compensation from Israel, what a laugh. It took them from 1967 until 1980 to pay 6 million dollars for a 40 million dollar ship. Does that look like they paid up front.

    John Hrankowski
    Survivor USS Liberty June 8 1967

  25. Eileen Fleming said on November 20th, 2007 at 6:57am #

    RE: Jamie’s ‘mumbo jumbo’ and what I have written and said repeatedly if Israel would honor its own Declaration of Establishment and the UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights-which was contingent upon their state hood and adhere to international law, we the Jewish people would have a safe and peaceful dwelling place.

    Democracy, justice and peace will never come thru military occupation and denying the other of human rights.

    A Few FACTS on WHY it is Apartheid in Israel and Palestine:

    According to a UN report, Haaretz columnist Danny Rubinstein admitted that “Israel today was an apartheid State with four different Palestinian groups: those in Gaza, East Jerusalem, the West Bank and Israeli Palestinians, each of which had a different status…even if the wall followed strictly the line of the pre-1967 border, it would still not be justified.” -http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3444320,00.html

    “An apartheid society is much more than just a ‘settler colony’. It involves specific forms of oppression that actively strip the original inhabitants of any rights at all, whereas civilian members of the invader caste are given all kinds of sumptuous privileges.” -“Apartheid Ancient, Past, and Present Systematic and Gross Human Rights Violations in Graeco-Roman Egypt, South Africa, and Israel/Palestine”, By Anthony Löwstedt. Page 77.

    On July 5, 1950, Israel enacted the Law of Return by which Jews anywhere in the world, have a “right” to immigrate to Israel on the grounds that they are returning to their own state, even if they have never been there before. – The Link, “About That Word Apartheid”, April-May 2007, Published by Americans for Middle East Understanding, Inc.

    On July 14, 1952: The enactment of the Citizenship/Jewish Nationality Law, results in Israel becoming the only state in the world to grant a particular national-religious group—the Jews—the right to settle in it and gain automatic citizenship. In 1953, South Africa’s Prime Minister Daniel Malan becomes the first foreign head of government to visit Israel and returns home with the message that Israel can be a source of inspiration for white South Africans. [IBID]

    In 1962, South African Prime Minister Verwoerd declares that Jews “took Israel from the Arabs after the Arabs had lived there for a thousand years. In that I agree with them, Israel, like South Africa, is an apartheid state.” [IBID]

    On August 1, 1967, Israel enacted the Agricultural Settlement Law, which bans Israeli citizens of non-Jewish nationality- Palestinian Arabs- from working on Jewish National Fund lands, well over 80% of the land in Israel. Knesset member Uri Avnery stated: “This law is going to expel Arab cultivators from the land that was formerly theirs and was handed over to the Jews.” [IBID]

    On April 4, 1969, General Moshe Dayan is quoted in the Israeli newspaper Ha’aretz telling students at Israel’s Technion Institute that “Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages. You don’t even know the names of these Arab villages, and I don’t blame you, because these geography books no longer exist. Not only do the books not exist, the Arab villages are not there either… There is not one single place built in this country that did not have a former Arab population.”[IBID]

    On April 28, 1971: C. L. Sulzberger, writing in The New York Times, quoted South African Prime Minister John Vorster as saying that Israel is faced with an apartheid problem, namely how to handle its Arab inhabitants. Sulzberger wrote: “Both South Africa and Israel are in a sense intruder states. They were built by pioneers originating abroad and settling in partially inhabited areas.” [IBID]

    On September 13, 1978, in Washington, D.C. The Camp David Accords are signed by Egyptian President Anwar Sadat and Israeli Prime Minister Menachem Begin and witnessed by President Jimmy Carter.

    The Accords reaffirm U.N. Resolutions 242 and 338, which prohibit acquisition of land by force, call for Israel’s withdrawal of military and civilian forces from the West Bank and Gaza, and prescribe “full autonomy” for the inhabitants of the territories. Begin orally promises Carter to freeze all settlement activity during the subsequent peace talks. Once back in Israel, however, the Israeli prime minister continues to confiscate, settle, and fortify the occupied territories. [IBID]

    On September 13, 1985, Rep. George Crockett (D-MI), after visiting the Israeli-occupied West Bank, compares the living conditions there with those of South African blacks and concludes that the West Bank is an instance of apartheid that no one in the U.S. is talking about. [IBID]

    In July 2000, President Bill Clinton convenes the Camp David II Peace Summit between Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Barak and Palestinian Authority Chairman Yasser Arafat. Clinton—not Barak—offers Arafat the withdrawal of some 40,000 Jewish settlers, leaving more than 180,000 in 209 settlements, all of which are interconnected by roads that cover approximately 10% of the occupied land. Effectively, this divides the West Bank into at least two non-contiguous areas and multiple fragments. Palestinians would have no control over the borders around them, the air space above them, or the water reserves under them. Barak calls it a generous offer. Arafat refuses to sign. [IBID]

    August 31, 2001: Durban, South Africa. Up to 50,000 South Africans march in support of the Palestinian people. In their “Declaration by South Africans on Apartheid and the Struggle for Palestine” they proclaim: “We, South Africans who lived for decades under rulers with a colonial mentality, see Israeli occupation as a strange survival of colonialism in the 21st century. Only in Israel do we hear of ‘settlements’ and ‘settlers.’ Only in Israel do soldiers and armed civilian groups take over hilltops, demolish homes, uproot trees and destroy crops, shell schools, churches and mosques, plunder water reserves, and block access to an indigenous population’s freedom of movement and right to earn a living. These human rights violations were unacceptable in apartheid South Africa and are an affront to us in apartheid Israel.” [IBID]

    October 23, 2001: Ronnie Kasrils, a Jew and a minister in the South African government, co-authors a petition “Not in My Name,” signed by some 200 members of South Africa’s Jewish community, reads: “It becomes difficult, from a South African perspective, not to draw parallels with the oppression expressed by Palestinians under the hand of Israel and the oppression experienced in South Africa under apartheid rule.” [IBID]

    Three years later, Kasrils will go to the Occupied Territories and conclude: “This is much worse than apartheid. Israeli measures, the brutality, make apartheid look like a picnic. We never had jets attacking our townships. We never had sieges that lasted month after month. We never had tanks destroying houses. We had armored vehicles and police using small arms to shoot people but not on this scale.” [IBID]

    April 29, 2002: Boston, MA. South African Archbishop Desmond Tutu says he is “very deeply distressed” by what he observed in his recent visit to the Holy Land, adding, “It reminded me so much of what happened in South Africa.” The Nobel peace laureate said he saw “the humiliation of the Palestinians at checkpoints and roadblocks, suffering like us when young white police officers prevented us from moving about. Referring to Americans, he adds, “People are scared in this country to say wrong is wrong because the Jewish lobby is powerful—very powerful. Well, so what? The apartheid government was very powerful, but today it no longer exists.” [IBID]

    LEARN MUCH MORE about the Apartheid Wall which divides Palestinians from Palestinians, denies them access to their legally owned land, resources, prevents them visiting their families and holy sites:
    http://www.arij.org
    http://www.stopthewall.org
    http://www.humanitarianinfo.org
    http://www.btselem.org
    http://www.sabeel.org
    http://www.pengon.org

  26. David Lewis said on November 20th, 2007 at 7:30am #

    I was the Intelligence Officer on board Liberty on that fateful day. If that attack on the Liberty was an accident, it was the best planned accident in the history of the earth. After 9 reconnaisance flights (when the ship was identified from Janes Fighting Ships as USS Liberty AGTR-5 in the IDF war room) They just accidentally took out every transmitting antenna on the ship. With an 18 foot diameter parabolic dish antenna aft of the stacks (for communicating via the moon) they claim we looked like an Egyptian HORSE CARRIER!! The Egyptians must have fabulous stables aboard ship. With antennas sprouting everywhere, Admiral Moorer (former Chairman of JCS) said we were the uglist ship on earth and could be mistaken by on one. It seems fantastic to me that anyone knowing the facts can still maintain that it was an accident. They certainly have more faith in Israel than they have in the United States

  27. Neal said on November 20th, 2007 at 11:44am #

    Ms. Fleming,

    With due respect, none of what you quote or cite shows anything about Israel’s nature. Your evidence shows that Israel has many enemies.

    Surely, you do not expect a sane person to care that a bunch of people marched in Durban. Do you happen to recall the signs that quite a number of marchers carried (e.g. Gas the Jews; Hitler did not finish the job; etc., etc.)? Do you recall that the Protocols of the Elders of Zion that was openly sold at the conference? Such people are ordinary bigots who show, quite clearly, why Jews need a state.

    Further, the evidence you cite about the settlement negotiations is contradicted by what President Clinton claims, which is that Israel agreed (but Arafat refused to agree), in December 2000, to allow a Palestinian Arab state on all of Gaza, 97% of the West Bank, to split Jerusalem with the Haram-esh-Sharif to be in Palestinian hands, to provide a land bridge to connect the West Bank and Gaza, to pay 30 billion dollars to be paid to Palestinian Arabs as compensation. In addition, Israel agreed to drop its claim for compensation related to the 856,000 Jewish refugees from Arab countries and related to the return of such people’s property which was stolen. I might add: such proposal would not, as a matter of simple examination of the map presented by President Clinton when the proposal was made, have resulted in any division of the West Bank. Such version of events, by the way, is also presented by the then Saudi Ambassador to the US, Prince Bandar, who says that Arafat lied about what occurred. And, such version of events is backed up by the transcript of the meeting, which can be obtained from the State Department. Perhaps you may want to check the US government’s records on the matter as they back up exactly what I have above written.

    But, let us assume that you are correct and that Israelis intentionally divide themselves from Palestinian Arabs to act, as South African whites acted, as a master race – rather than, as I contend, the Israelis do what is necessary protect themselves from being massacred -, how, Eileen, is Israel worse than France – a country in which large contingents of citizens and non-citizens of non-European ancestry are in open rebellion against France, viewing the government as illegitimate, and, of course, are treated like dirt by the French government and people – including situating such non-Christian population in segregated, decrepit banlieues?

    By your definition, France is an apartheid state. Where is the outrage from you?

    Now, the simple fact in the case of Israel is that the ruling party on the Palestinian Arab side, the HAMAS, openly advocates genocide. In fact, such appears in that organization’s founding covenant. In fact, that covenant does not limit the dispute to Israel but asserts claims against Jews all over the world. And, it asserts that Jews have been behind every war since the French Revolution. In fact, the covenant considers the Protocols of the Elders of Zion to be a real document.

    And, while I am writing here about the HAMAS, I note that the organization targets civilians as its policy of first choice – as openly asserted by its leaders. Needless to say, they have acted on such policy.

    But, in your book, none of that seems to matter. What seems to bother you is that Israel defends its ground from lunatic, genocidal enemies who refuse to accept what, as Prince Bandar stated, amounted to their own official settlement proposal, as made by President Clinton in December of 2000 and accepted at that time by Israel.

  28. Ken said on November 20th, 2007 at 12:24pm #

    It appears that once again a serious discussion about the USS Liberty attack has been hijacked by folks with other “fish to fry.”

    Some people see the USS Liberty attack as a symptom of a systemic infection that’s gradually killing the State of Israel; and others see it as a localized infection that never healed correctly, but is not fatal to Israel.

    As I read Elieen’s article, it appears focused on the attack and the survivors anguish — except for the last statement. Then I read Elieen’s comments, egged by Jamie and Neal, and find that perhaps there is a alternative agenda — on both sides of the fence.

    Once again, justice for the survivors gets pushed into the background and politics rule the day.

  29. Eileen Fleming said on November 20th, 2007 at 1:27pm #

    MY AGENDA began after THAT DAY we call 9/11.

    I didn’t want to go shop as Pres. Bush instructed we the people to do and the media wasn’t asking my questions.

    I wanted to know WHY did a few-and back then it was but a few-people in the world hated Americans so much that they could cold bloodedly murder innocent people.

    I also wanted to do some good in the world and that lead me to the Interfaith Olive Trees Foundation for Peace/OTFFP and that lead me to journey five times into Israel Palestine.

    Through a supporter and friend of OTFFP, I was shown a photo of George of Beit Jala/West Bethlehem, taken in 2000, by photographer Debbie Hill.

    It is George who adorns the banner on my website.

    George was captured the morning after the Israeli army destroyed his bedroom in retaliation for a few hopeless militants who had infiltrated his once peaceful Christian village to snipe across the way into the illegal settlement/colony of Gilo about a mile away.

    The shrapnel that pierced the wall of George’s sanctuary read:

    “Made in USA”

    It was delivered via American made Apache helicopters.

    The second I saw George’s eyes, in that photo that was first published by the Florida Catholic, my heart said:

    “DO SOMETHING!”

    What could I possibly do I wondered, but I did make a copy of the photo, put it in a frame and placed it upon the altar [a bar high table] in the upper room of my home.

    Dozens of times a day, I would stop and gaze into the eyes of that little boy of the little town of Bethlehem: OCCUPIED TERRITORY and beg God to end the insane cycle of violence in the Holy Land for the sake of all the children who live there and free me from the incessant voice that demands i:

    “DO SOMETHING!”

    All these years later, every time I look at George’s eyes-or even think about him-the persistent voice continues the incessant refrain:

    “DO SOMETHING!”

    When I met George for the first time in June 2005, I vowed to him that the rest of my life will be dedicated to doing all I could to help bring about the end of the occupation of Palestine, which has now entered its 40th year.

    STEP 2:

    In April 2005, two months before my first trip to Israel Palestine, I tuned the TV on and the History channel appeared.

    They were broadcasting a show called, “Sexpionage” all about Russian female spies and one from the Mossad.

    The very clip that ran before my eyes was of Mordecahi Vanunu being transported to his closed door trial capturing his inspired move to write upon his palm: “HIJACKED” and the Rome flight number he had been on.

    It was the first time I had seen that historic clip and also of Shimon Perez in 1986 stating that Israel would never be the first in the Mid East to possess nuclear weapons.

    When a black and white photo of a bearded, unkempt and disheveled Vanunu filled the TV screen, I thought his eyes looked just like George’s of Beit Jala’s, and I heard in my heart:

    “Do Something!”

    Vanunu’s eyes are nothing like George’s, but I have been streaming video of my Vanunu interviews taped in 2005 and 2006.

    Vanunu was baptized a Christian in 1986, just a few days before being kidnapped by the Mossad and spending 18 yrs. in jail for telling the world THE TRUTH that Israel had gone nuclear.

    Step 3:

    When I was asked to speak in California on Oct. 13, 2007 about Vanunu’s FREEDOM OF SPEECH trial and recent sentence of 6 more months in jail because of interviews he gave in 2004, and that the “NO MORE WARS FOR ISRAEL” Conference was dedicated to him and would be a fund raising opportunity:

    I went with hope for doing some good. Being a Christian I have a habit of trusting people are as honest and upfront as I am, and once again learned the lesson; most are not.

    But, it was at that conference that I met my first LIBERTY Vet, Phil Tounrey, another speaker.

    When he said:

    “It was God that kept us afloat.”

    I heard in my heart:

    “DO SOMETHING!”

    I have a Triune Agenda:

    1. DOING SOMETHING to help end the brutal occupation of Palestine,
    supporting

    2. supporting Vanunu in the spirit of Article 19 of the UN Universal Declaration Human Rights-which Israel agreed to uphold and was contingent upon their statehood:

    “Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers.”

    3. Seeking JUSTICE for the LIBERTY VETS and helping them get all they have been asking of our government: an open investigation of that day in infamy when the media went MIA and Congress went limp!

    e

  30. Phillip Tourney said on November 20th, 2007 at 5:13pm #

    I guess we will have to keep the ten thousand offered for now. No one can prove us liars when we now that the Goverment of Israel are nothing but that.What they can”t steal from the USA Jhon Pollard for one they get it from spys from Israel.
    You can”t trust Murdering Liars and thives and that is what they are as is our goverment for letting them get buy with it.
    The truth will over come you can bet on that. Thanks to Eileen and her faith it will happen.
    Phillip F Tourney
    Survivor eye wittnes to Isralis cold blooded murder June 8 1967 of Americans on the high seas.

  31. Joel Lehman said on November 20th, 2007 at 5:57pm #

    I,m a USS Liberty survivor. There is no way I can be convinced that such a well coordinated attack could be an accident.

  32. carlos ponce said on November 20th, 2007 at 6:02pm #

    Ms. Fleming,
    I really praise your heartening contribution to this investigation. It is time to clarify the genocidal nature of the Israeli Apartheid System, destroying the blameless lives of Palestinians. Israel is made of “mistakes” and assassinations that should be investigated.
    Operation Damocles (West Germany and Egypt, 1962-1963)

    What happened: Between September 1962 and March 1963, Israel attempted to disrupt Egyptian research, assisted by West German scientists, into military rockets. Israel killed a number of people during this operation, including five with a letter bomb on November 28, 1962.

    Shooting Down of Libya Airlines Flight 114 (February 21, 1973)

    What happened: Disoriented in a sudden sandstorm on a regular flight from Tripoli to Cairo, Flight 114 entered airspace over the Sinai peninsula, then occupied by Israel. Within minutes, Israel shot the plane down, killing 106 of the 113 on board, including an American. The place crashed only 20 kilometers from the Egyptian-Sinai line. Prime Minister Golda Meir, Defense Minister Moshe Dayan, and Transportation Minister Shimon Peres found no fault with the Israel’s actions. Yes! It is time to clarify what happened to the US Liberty!

  33. Neal said on November 20th, 2007 at 7:15pm #

    Ms. Fleming,

    The problem with your point of view is that it ignores the legitimate concerns of the Israelis, which – no matter what you claim, largely out of profound ignorance – are real.

    In your lexicon, a soldier – which is what Palestinians who attack Israelis actually are – who intentionally breaks into a “settlement” – in English, a village – and massacres civilians living in that village is a “hopeless militant.” No, Eileen. The person is a war criminal who is acting on the orders of a leader who is a war criminal. And, I might add: if you examine traditional just war theory, you will see that the very strategy adopted by Palestinian Arabs is unjust and illegitimate.

    No. Hoping to end “occupation” does not make it alright to make civilians the target of first choice. Massacring civilians is the tactic of barbarians, not people worthy of support.

    Now, that should not be read as my supporting Israel’s position regarding how it rules Palestinian Arabs or where it wants Israelis to live. It is, rather, my statement that civilians are not a legitimate target and that people who support those with that point of view are, in my view, hypocrites and, in most instances, anti-Jewish bigots.

    Consider that your “hopeless” militants are, to Israelis, people who commit massacres and not by accident but with premeditation. The evidence that such is the case is overwhelming . In fact, the Hamas leadership has bragged about that to the extent that the New York Times has quoted the leadership on its use of such tactics and on its plans to ethnically cleanse the region of Jews, just as Arab Muslims have done throughout the Arab regions.

    Now, you seem to think that this is all a simple thing. It is not. There are rights and wrongs all around. Saying, as you do, that you want peace and justice ought to suggest to you that justice is not a one way street. Again: we have the Palestinian leadership which refused to accept in December of 2000, in the face of President Clinton, the publicly stated position of the PLO. That, as Prince Bandar notes, means that all of the blood that has been spilt since is on the head of Arafat and those who were silent about what he allowed to occur.

    Now, if you want to understand this dispute a bit better, I suggest you consider that the reason that Arafat refused his own position is that his population is not ready to settle the dispute. And, that is because they think they have, in the long term, the upper hand. And that comes from seeing 300 million Arabs and 5 million Jews. Were I on their side, I would see the matter that way also.

    Hence, they take the view that by creating an unbearable situation for the Israelis, they will eventually force a crisis among the Israeli population in which they simply lose the will to defend themselves. I might add: there is historical precedent for such approach, such being a traditional tactic employed by Middle Easterners in their many wars.

    What is rather awful about the war against Israel is that non-Middle Easterners who know exactly nothing about that part of the world (e.g. maybe you) project their own issues onto Middle Easterners. Consider your comment about getting to understand why 9/11 occurred. To get to the bottom of that, you need to read what those in the Jihadist movement say to each other – not what they direct to us for propaganda purposes.

    Frankly, their main concern is not Israel, which they call a mere “petty” state. Which is to say, Israel is a greater concern to you than to them.

    Their main concern is to restore Islamic military and political power, to eliminate Western, non-Muslim, cultural influence over Muslims and, in the end, to create circumstances where Muslims will have a realistic opportunity for conquest. If you do not believe that, then trying reading some books where they express their opinions to each other. You will see that I am correct.

  34. Neal said on November 21st, 2007 at 10:37am #

    To the comment immediately above: “Dissident Voice : Seconding Captain McGonagle’s Two Word Epithet.”

    I have no problem compensating people for their losses. I do have a problem with people who would manipulate these real losses into a phony cause.

  35. David said on November 21st, 2007 at 1:10pm #

    To Neal and Jaime: words really cannot express the shame I feel, as a Jew and an American, when I read the terribly callous and hurtful remarks made against these brave men. Can’t you see that all they are looking for is TRUTH and JUSTICE? And to refer to these brave men as “bigots” is a shameful example of an ad hominem attack. Are you even aware that there were American Jews killed on that ship? Please try to put yourself in their position and see how you would feel…

    To those men still fighting for 40 years, I say “Shalom” to you all. You are fighting for justice which is richly deserved.

  36. Neal said on November 21st, 2007 at 2:29pm #

    To David,

    See my point above. I am not against compensation for and recognition of the suffering of people harmed by the horrors of war. But, I am against people trying to make phony, political hay out of an accident, claiming it to be deliberate – not because it was but in order to vent their bigoted views about Israel and Jews.

    Again, I do appreciate that those harmed have rights. I do not, however, respect how Ms. Fleming wishes to exploit an accident for her political views that support the marchers in Durban. Such Durban marchers were bigots who carried “Kill the Jews” signs – and note above that she explicitly cites her approval for the Durban “human rights” conference, perhaps the lowest point in the history of the “human rights” movement -.

    Such people at Durban were not seeking justice and human rights. They are seeking revenge. So, I oppose her brief for those killed on the Liberty which, to me, is her phony brief. Her real agenda is stated in the comments, as we managed to extract from her. Again: the events at Durban were a moral travesty, a regular hatefest under the banner of human rights. Those marchers are to human rights what the reign of terror was to the French revolution. A nightmare.

  37. Ken said on November 21st, 2007 at 7:46pm #

    The attack was NOT an accident. According to the IDF History Report (the one containing the fake gun camera photos), its air force and navy made a CONSCIOUS DECISION TO ATTACK AN UNIDENTIFIED SHIP, in international waters. A deliberate attack on an unidentified ship in international waters is not an accident — it’s a violation of international maritime law and the laws of war.

    According to the IDF, the ship was NOT misidentified by the attacking pilots — it was NEVER identified by the attacking pilots. Later, after the air attack, the Motor Torpedo Boats (MTBs) arrived and the IDF claims two of the three MTB captains misidentified USS Liberty as the Egyptian horse carrier El Quseir, as she rapidly headed north. After several tries, a torpedo finally hit. The ship came to a halt, but it didn’t sink. The MTBs continued attacking — up close and personal — and, according to the IDF, the MTB captains still didn’t realize the ship was American, despite the large American flag and large GTR5 letters on its bow. The ship launched life rafts. The MTBs shot the life rafts full of holes — not by accident, but on purpose — a prima facie war crime.

    Neal, if you chose to believe the IDF’s version of events, which appears to be the case, then at the very least the attack was a reckless and wanton act that resulted in the deaths of 34 Americans — commonly known as Second Degree Murder in many states of the United States. But, alas, the Israeli military judge reviewing charges brought against the attackers, by an Israeli military prosecutor, didn’t see this way — surprise, surprise.

    War is hell — especially when it’s in the form of a surprise attack, on a clear and sunny day, as you lay sunbathing on the decks of a clearly marked and neutral US Navy auxiliary vessel.

  38. Bill Webb said on November 22nd, 2007 at 11:04am #

    Ms. Fleming,
    I THANK YOU for all you do to bring attention to the USS LIBERTY. I am a disabled Navy Vet who served from 7/69 to 7/73. I never heard about the USS LIBERTY until after 9/11 when I too wondered why we were hated so. When I realized that Israel has violated UN res.242 for 40 years, had many UN res. denied by the US and has continued it’s Arab land grab and settlement building on occupied land. We didn’t allow Saddam to invade Kuwait and grab land yet we allow Israel. It does seem like APARTHEID to many including President Carter. I think every AMERICAN would be fighting any way we could if we were treated as the Palestinians have been. REMEMBER THE LIBERTY

  39. Survivor 67 said on November 23rd, 2007 at 8:52am #

    Before the attack on the Liberty there were no names attached to the
    survivors hinting that they might be racists with a different agenda.
    Only after the attack and we wouldn’t let them hide the truth did the
    name calling began. I have never seen it fail on one web site or the
    other, the discussion usually digresses to name calling, deception,
    and a real effort to shift the focus of the discussion to some other point
    that has nothing to do with the attack. I am sure they feel that their
    mission has been accomplished when that effort sways the subject to
    a completely different topic. I have been on one site where that was
    not allowed to happen. The facts were presented, evidence layed out
    for all to see, and the result was a site that was void of unrelated
    subjects. You would be surprised at the truth laid bare for all to see.

  40. David said on November 23rd, 2007 at 11:48am #

    Survivor 67′,
    Thank you for ‘hitting the nail on the head’ in regard to these people who “digress to name calling, deception…” and other verbal chicanery to incite others to stoop to their level. They are the ones with an “agenda”–to try and be as vicious as possible in hopes of “extracting” (as Neal put it) some emotionally inflamed response that could, in turn, be construed as racist or anti-semitic. Their form of argument has no place in the area of civilized public discourse.

    And the continued use of “accidental” or “phony cause” is simply repugnant and, frankly, embarrasing–for him!! Notice how he ignores the salient facts about the attack? These are facts released by the Israelis themselves!! Two minutes before the attack, several ground control personnel are heard saying, “Americans? Where are there Americans?” Then the murderous attack begins, followed later by an astonishing admission by the fire control officer questioned about the identity of the ship: it’s “apparently American”.

    In closing, I find it interesting that a poll taken in Israel (by Haaretz) shows approximately 3/4 of those asked believe the attack WAS DELIBERATE. Again I say to the Liberty survivors: Shalom. Woe unto the shameless naysayers…

  41. hp said on November 25th, 2007 at 2:13pm #

    “By way of deception.” I mean c’mon, this is literally carved into stone for all to see.
    To then deny it, even when caught red handed, is psychopathic.

  42. Simpleswine said on January 3rd, 2008 at 5:00pm #

    Eileen Fleming said on November 18th, 2007 at 7:48 pm #

    Thanks for all the input, and am most grateful for what you wrote ‘Deadbeat!’

    Dear Jamie and Neal,

    First off, my main issue is the USA government cover-up and callous and reckless disregard for our Veterans.

    In checking the Congressional Record you will see the only investigation was the original Naval Court of Inquiry.

    The Liberty Veterans Association has offered $10,000 reward to anyone who can prove there was ever a Congressional investigation and so far, no takers!

    The Naval Court of Inquiry was done by two officers under the command of Senator John McCain, Sr. and it was concluded in six days.

    Wow.. what facts! Well, not really… it was NOT John sr (Admiral McCain), NOR was it John III (that would be Senator McCain)(you know, the guy running for President?).. it WAS John jr (III’s daddy, the Admiral).. oh, and III? He was a guest of the VC during the investigation… yawn, nice try though… but it does bring into question the veracity of your “investigation”… a main fact wrong?
    Face it, anti-semitism, Repub hate, and plain old BDS… that is your true motivator.

    I’m going to take a wild guess… lib democrat?
    Naw, don’t answer, it’s obvious.

  43. Eileen Fleming said on January 3rd, 2008 at 7:01pm #

    dear Simpleswine,

    Yes, i do know i made a typo on the John McCain deal- one of the LIBERTY survivors alerted me immediately to it, but as i cannot edit my articles once they are published elsewhere, my limitations follow me.

    i would love to have an editor HELP me, for i spill thousands of cyber words from my heart and gut nearly daily; but i still work solo and am only human doing the best i can.

    BUT you are WAY OFF BASE in your assertion:

    “Face it, anti-semitism, Repub hate, and plain old BDS… that is your true motivator. I’m going to take a wild guess… lib democrat?
    Naw, don’t answer, it’s obvious.”

    I will answer:

    You are dead wrong about me simpleswine!

    I just submitted article 7 in my LIBERTY series to DV a few hours ago and it will BLOW YOUR BS mudslinging anti-semitic canard out of the water.

    I have NO faith in the democrats to save we the people- we the people better WAKE UP and save ourselves and it begins with regaining COMMON SENSE which Bush’s Doctrine of Fear sent MIA :

    “Soon after I had published the pamphlet “Common Sense” [on Feb. 14, 1776] in America, I saw the exceeding probability that a revolution in the system of government would be followed by a revolution in the system of religion… The world is my country, all mankind are my brethren, and to do good is my religion.”-Tom Paine

    i SAY BYE BYE 2 u with the words the IDF said to me at every checkpoint as i traveled thru OPT

    “HAVE A NICE DAY”

    e