I am happy to see some of this because when I look on sites which discuss things mostly from the Palestinian side, I find more openly racist dehumanizing and hysteria than I have seen since I read Nazi and Fascist literature a long time ago. It’s sad and scary that a cause that needs support from reasonable people – the plight of the Palestinians – gets used by people who want to whip themselves into a frenzy of murderous self-righteousness. Such people are the best argument I’ve seen in support of a position I don’t like: that there is no one for the Israelis to negotiate with.

There will never be peace unless both sides can treat the other side as humans. The Israeli peace movement exist: there are Jews working hard for justice for the Palestinians. We need the Palestinians who are willing to talk to be save from killing by Hamas and other fanatics.

All issues need to be discussed: will the right of return (including recovery of property) be granted to Jews who fled Arab countries? The right of return was not granted to Greeks and Turks when they were separated, to Muslims and Hindus when Pakistan was created. There can’t be rigid pre-conditions before talks can start. The current situation is too cruel to the refugees. Self-righteousness will get us nowhere.

With regard to religion, an ethnically identified Jew need not practice Judaism. The latter is the religion. Said Jew may be an atheist or even a Buddhist. Ethnicity and religion are not necessarily coincident.

Do you think you can make your points without vilifying them as a people?

you may not be aware of this fact or you are trying to make us think that a “jew” is no different than a “russian”.
a label like “american” does not evoke her/his cult; oops, religion. The label “jew” evokes in most peoples’ minds also mosheism, judaism, talmudism.
it evokes “jewishness”: separatism, divisiveness, supranaturalness, avoidance of hard work, connectedeness to hebrews [even tho they evanesced], theft of land/money, self promotion at expense of others, etc.

however, if one looks at you and sees two legs, a head, digestive and nervous systems, tongue, lips, etc., all that can be compared with my lips, legs, arms, etc.
in short, a human can be compared to any human! Once her “jewishness” or catholishness comes up, that person is not any longer human first!
tnx

Besides being a waste of time and space, you are a piece of lying scum. I won’t dignify your lies by debating them with you.

The fact that I know you are a bald faced liar does not mean I have anything against Jews as such; indeed it was my exposure to the thoughts and writings of intelligent Jews that clued me in to the true character of the movement founded by Herr Herzl et al, and to the true nature of the racist state created by said movement.

So don’t reply to me, reply to Israel Shahak, Rabbi Elmer Berger, Alfred Lilienthal, Steve Goldfield, Hilton Obenzinger, Jeff Blankfort and the other Jews who set me straight on people like you. David has it right in his comment above: “thieves, thugs, murderers and liars”.

To paraphrase Proudhon, “Israel” is theft.

Much wasted verbiage on your part. Setting aside your childish comments, nothing in your response in any way refutes my contention that the end result – not today or tomorrow- but inevitably, will be one state between the Jordan River and the Med. Sea. It will come about because after a period of reconciliation (temporary two states) the majority of Jews and Palestinians will want it. One secular state will lead to great economic and social opportunities for both peoples. Jews of foreign origin will become fully integrated into the Middle East and they as well as Palestinian Muslims, Christians, Druze etc. (as well as the rest of the world) will finally be free of the curse of zionism, a nineteenth century racist settler/colonialist ideology which will be assigned to history’s dust bin.

BTW, Israel is not a “democratic” state. It is at best, an ethnocracy where a citizen’s access to humanitarian and democratic rights is determined by his/her religion and ethnicity. This is well illustrated by the fact that there is not such thing as an “Israeli.” Only Jewish and non-Jewish citizens of Israel who have to carry identity cards. Israel is the only country in the world that differentiates between citizenship and nationality.

To quote two historians who are Jewish citizens of Israel:
Ilan Pappe, former professor of political science at Haifa University, now at the University of London: “[Israel's] political system [is] exclusionary, a pro forma democracy – going through the motions of democratic rule but essentially being akin to apartheid or Herenvolk (‘master race’) democracy.”

Adi Ophir, philosophy professor at Tel Aviv University: “…the adoption of the political forms of an ethnocentric and racist nation-state in general, are turning Israel into the most dangerous place in the world for the humanity and morality of the Jewish community, for the continuity of Jewish cultures and perhaps for Jewish existence itself.”

Ronnie Kasrils, minister for intelligence in the current South African government and also of the Jewish faith, is eminently qualified to comment on Israel’s “democracy.” In an article published in The Guardian he and his co-author concisely sum of the plight of Israel’s Palestinian/Arab citizens: “The Palestinian minority in Israel has for decades been denied basic equality in health, education, housing and land possession, solely because it is not Jewish. The fact that this minority is allowed to vote hardly redresses the rampant injustice in all other basic human rights. They are excluded from the very definition of the ‘Jewish state’, and have virtually no influence on the laws, or political, social and economic policies. Hence, their similarity to the black South Africans [under apartheid].” (The Guardian, 25 May 2005)

Get educated!!!

First Hamas-made movie begins Gaza Strip run

By Nidal Al Mughrabi
Reuters
GAZA – The audience in the Gaza Strip clapped and cheered as the actor delivered the movie’s most memorable line.

“To kill Israeli soldiers is to worship God.” “Imad Aqel”, which had its premiere on Saturday, is the first feature film produced by the Islamist Hamas movement and the title is the name of a Palestinian fighter whom Israel held accountable for the deaths of 13 soldiers and settlers.

In accordance with strict Muslim tradition, men and women sat in separate sections of the theatre to view what Hamas officials termed the “Cinema of Resistance”, referring to what it describes as a fight against Israeli occupation.

“Imad Aqel” was filmed on a set built inside the former Jewish settlement of Ganei Tal in the Hamas-controlled Gaza Strip.

It depicts Hamas’ founding in the 1980s, attacks Aqel mounted on the Israeli military in the West Bank and Gaza Strip and the signing of the Oslo peace accord between Israel and the Palestine Liberation Organisation in 1993.

The film cost $120,000 and was written by Mahmoud Al Zahar, a senior leader of Hamas, which the West regards as a terrorist group and shuns because of its refusal to renounce violence, recognise Israel and accept existing interim peace deals.

Aqel was killed at the age of 22 by Israeli soldiers who surrounded his hideout in Gaza in 1993.

Four of the actors in the film, which took several months to make, were later killed in the 22-day offensive Israel launched in the Gaza Strip last December with the declared aim of halting cross-border rocket attacks by Palestinian fighters.

Majed Jendeya, the movie’s German-trained director, said he hoped to screen the film at the Cannes Festival in France. The movie is Hamas’ latest foray into the mass media – it owns a satellite TV channel, a radio station and several newspapers.

sane person wld never condemn a ‘jew’; only what a ‘jew’ does!
and if a ‘jew’ is first of all a human being and, thus, on equal footing with every other human being, no problem arises of whatever kind.

the problem will will always arise if one’s “jewishness”; i.e., his lore/culture/ cult comes in importance ahead of his humaness.
a person who considers self first of all jehovah’s witness, rejects not only one’s ethnicity but also one’s humanity.
but jehovahs witnessses are not feared/hated as much as ‘jews’ in the main because they do not consider selves as supranatural beings as ‘jews’ do.

even nazis, as bad as they were, did not assert that germans were supranatural; just superior. And only slavs, gypsies., an dother peoples with ‘tainted’ skin.

yes insanity, whether nazistic or talmudic/mosheic is to be feared and hated. Good news is, it will be destroyed, thank my devil! tnx

Mebosa Ritchie: You demonstrate an appalling and inexcusable ignorance of history. Prior to the 1947 UNGA Partition Plan (Res. 181),
neither the Balfour Declaration (Nov. 2, 1917) nor resolutions passed by the League of Nations (e.g., terms of the British Mandate) or its successor, the United Nations proposed a “two state” solution for Palestine. I also remind you that UNGA Res. 181 had no status in law and was recommendatory only. It was also grossly unfair to the indigenous Palestinians and hence, unworkable – so much so that at the behest of Truman, the UNGA was in the process of shelving it in favour of a UN Trusteeship for Palestine when Ben-Gurion/Gruen et al. declared the state of Israel. It would seem that you are also unaware that between passage of UNGA Res. 181 (Nov. 29/47) and the declaration of the state of Israel, Jewish militias had already expelled over 300,000 Palestinians and were continuing to do so. This is what led to the intervention of outnumbered and outgunned Arab state armies into Palestine. During the ensuing war Israel’s forces defeated the Arab armies, expelled a further 500,000 Palestinians, demolished about 450 of their towns and villages and occupied 78% of Palestine. As for your contention that the Palestinians turned down a “two state” solution at Camp David 2000, get to the history books and learn what really happened. Arafat was not offered a real state. He was offered bantustans under Israel’s boot. You are apparently not aware that excluded from the so-called “generous offer” were huge areas of the West Bank that Israel has illegally incorporated into the boundaries of occupied East Jerusalem and continues to do so.

The inescapable truths are: Israel is the occupier, Palestinians are the occupied; Israel is the ethnic-cleanser, Palestinians are the dispossessed; Israel is the oppressor, Palestinians are the oppressed; Palestinians have international law on their side, Israel is a gross violator of international law; Palestinians have the moral and legal right to resist; Palestinians have time and demographics on their side and will emerge victorious, leading eventually to the inevitable and only real solution to the conflict: one democratic secular state. The handwriting is on the wall. READ IT!!!