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	<title>Comments on: Murder Trumps Torture Says Bugliosi</title>
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	<description>a radical newsletter in the struggle for peace and social justice</description>
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		<title>By: Michael Collins</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/04/murder-trumps-torture-says-bugliosi/#comment-42894</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Collins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 03:46:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dissidentvoice.org/?p=7620#comment-42894</guid>
		<description>Brian, I don&#039;t know enough about the JFK assassination to hold my own in any questioning.  I see the murder as a conspiracy and Oswald as a peripheral figure.  But I&#039;m in 100% accord with Bugliosi&#039;s efforts regarding the Bush regime.  They must be brought to justice.  I also supported and was very impressed by his post 2000 book on Bush v. Gore.    The Kennedy murder(s) are central to every thing that has come since but I&#039;m more interested in the Bush crew murders.  

rosmarie, the more listen and read, the more I&#039;m convinced that the political system has become a puppet show.  There&#039;s pretend democracy, pretend freedom of the press and freedom of speech, and pretend sympathy for the people and their troubles.  Of course they wouldn&#039;t cover you, it might cost them something.  

Vince Bugliosi is a great proof for pervasive censorship.  The media loved him when he had true crime novels that sold in the millions.  But when he had a NYT best seller on Bush, no coverage except for a CNN interview where the editing made it look like he was opposed to prosecuting Bush.   Nevertheless, the book sold and people are getting the message.  

The utter insincerity of it all is really something to behold.   We&#039;re ruled by concerns that can only win when they break all the rules, rules they&#039;ve had a hand in making in the first place.    The veil has been pierced and is falling off the facade of contempt for the people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brian, I don&#8217;t know enough about the JFK assassination to hold my own in any questioning.  I see the murder as a conspiracy and Oswald as a peripheral figure.  But I&#8217;m in 100% accord with Bugliosi&#8217;s efforts regarding the Bush regime.  They must be brought to justice.  I also supported and was very impressed by his post 2000 book on Bush v. Gore.    The Kennedy murder(s) are central to every thing that has come since but I&#8217;m more interested in the Bush crew murders.  </p>
<p>rosmarie, the more listen and read, the more I&#8217;m convinced that the political system has become a puppet show.  There&#8217;s pretend democracy, pretend freedom of the press and freedom of speech, and pretend sympathy for the people and their troubles.  Of course they wouldn&#8217;t cover you, it might cost them something.  </p>
<p>Vince Bugliosi is a great proof for pervasive censorship.  The media loved him when he had true crime novels that sold in the millions.  But when he had a NYT best seller on Bush, no coverage except for a CNN interview where the editing made it look like he was opposed to prosecuting Bush.   Nevertheless, the book sold and people are getting the message.  </p>
<p>The utter insincerity of it all is really something to behold.   We&#8217;re ruled by concerns that can only win when they break all the rules, rules they&#8217;ve had a hand in making in the first place.    The veil has been pierced and is falling off the facade of contempt for the people.</p>
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		<title>By: rosemarie jackowski</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/04/murder-trumps-torture-says-bugliosi/#comment-42872</link>
		<dc:creator>rosemarie jackowski</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 19:46:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dissidentvoice.org/?p=7620#comment-42872</guid>
		<description>Martha ... Thanks for the support.  An important point is that besides State Attorneys General all County Prosecutors have the power to Indict. It is mind-numbing to realize that with so many with the power - none will step forward.

Michael... Vermont is controlled by the 2 political Parties. It is a myth that this is a Progressive State.  One of the problems during the campaign season was that most Vermont newspapers refused to cover the campaigns of candidates who were not dem/repubs.  The Democratic Machine  controls  the Office of AG.  The scandal is described in articles about Dean/Sorrell by Joshua Frank .  The media, or lack of media, is a big part of the problem. During the campaign Bugliosi came to Vermont.  His visit received very little Press coverage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Martha &#8230; Thanks for the support.  An important point is that besides State Attorneys General all County Prosecutors have the power to Indict. It is mind-numbing to realize that with so many with the power &#8211; none will step forward.</p>
<p>Michael&#8230; Vermont is controlled by the 2 political Parties. It is a myth that this is a Progressive State.  One of the problems during the campaign season was that most Vermont newspapers refused to cover the campaigns of candidates who were not dem/repubs.  The Democratic Machine  controls  the Office of AG.  The scandal is described in articles about Dean/Sorrell by Joshua Frank .  The media, or lack of media, is a big part of the problem. During the campaign Bugliosi came to Vermont.  His visit received very little Press coverage.</p>
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		<title>By: bozh</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/04/murder-trumps-torture-says-bugliosi/#comment-42865</link>
		<dc:creator>bozh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 16:09:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dissidentvoice.org/?p=7620#comment-42865</guid>
		<description>prosecuting or putting to death of  a few individuals [proportionately speaking, ooo1% of the pop, let&#039;s say] had not changed even an iota our [panhuman] ill-habits.

may be the master of our  murderous habits had gone to our genes; so a higher power [&#039;gods&#039;, genes, nature] may be our master.
maybe our genetic makeup became such a controling force of our panhuman behavior because of millennial misteachings by shamanism followed by cults, lords, sirs, sires, earls, barons, counts, princes, kings, marshals, generals, &#039;educators&#039;, clergy, and many other disinformants.

in short, we have been urged to adapt to a fictitious reality presented to us by above people hoping to permamently enslave us also thru genes and not just by brute force.

if this be true, then the answer and savior wld be reversal of our genetics thru presenting true reality to which even wolves, rats must adapt to to survive.
survival being the ultimate test of success.  so, enlightenment and only enlightenment wld save and liberate us from our serfdom and even slavery.

present  &#039;education&#039;  is controled by modern enserfers/enslavers. and there may be a possibility that the modern warlords may voluntary enact enlightenment.

but not likely!  at least some of us are begining  to enlighten people. it&#039;s a modest begining; in decades to come we can teach 90% of people everywhere to resist modern rulers supported by clergy, media/entertainment people, &#039;educators&#039; , schools. tnx</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>prosecuting or putting to death of  a few individuals [proportionately speaking, ooo1% of the pop, let's say] had not changed even an iota our [panhuman] ill-habits.</p>
<p>may be the master of our  murderous habits had gone to our genes; so a higher power ['gods', genes, nature] may be our master.<br />
maybe our genetic makeup became such a controling force of our panhuman behavior because of millennial misteachings by shamanism followed by cults, lords, sirs, sires, earls, barons, counts, princes, kings, marshals, generals, &#8216;educators&#8217;, clergy, and many other disinformants.</p>
<p>in short, we have been urged to adapt to a fictitious reality presented to us by above people hoping to permamently enslave us also thru genes and not just by brute force.</p>
<p>if this be true, then the answer and savior wld be reversal of our genetics thru presenting true reality to which even wolves, rats must adapt to to survive.<br />
survival being the ultimate test of success.  so, enlightenment and only enlightenment wld save and liberate us from our serfdom and even slavery.</p>
<p>present  &#8216;education&#8217;  is controled by modern enserfers/enslavers. and there may be a possibility that the modern warlords may voluntary enact enlightenment.</p>
<p>but not likely!  at least some of us are begining  to enlighten people. it&#8217;s a modest begining; in decades to come we can teach 90% of people everywhere to resist modern rulers supported by clergy, media/entertainment people, &#8216;educators&#8217; , schools. tnx</p>
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		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/04/murder-trumps-torture-says-bugliosi/#comment-42864</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 15:48:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dissidentvoice.org/?p=7620#comment-42864</guid>
		<description>Ask him why he wrote such an error laden book about the Kennedy case.
JFK assassination documentary expert, History Professor David R. Wrone takes it apart here, finding dozens of errors in just one small section of the book and leaving the reader to wonder about the quality of his research and the credibility of his lone gunman theory.
http://www.maryferrell.org/wiki/index.php/Essay_-_Vincent_Bugliosis_Misnamed_Reclaiming_History</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ask him why he wrote such an error laden book about the Kennedy case.<br />
JFK assassination documentary expert, History Professor David R. Wrone takes it apart here, finding dozens of errors in just one small section of the book and leaving the reader to wonder about the quality of his research and the credibility of his lone gunman theory.<br />
<a href="http://www.maryferrell.org/wiki/index.php/Essay_-_Vincent_Bugliosis_Misnamed_Reclaiming_History" rel="nofollow">http://www.maryferrell.org/wiki/index.php/Essay_-_Vincent_Bugliosis_Misnamed_Reclaiming_History</a></p>
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		<title>By: Martha</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/04/murder-trumps-torture-says-bugliosi/#comment-42862</link>
		<dc:creator>Martha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 15:02:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dissidentvoice.org/?p=7620#comment-42862</guid>
		<description>rosemarie jackowski, I always love your writing and insight.  Didn&#039;t realize you ran for office last go round.  Though you didn&#039;t get in, I&#039;m sure you made a difference, planting seeds. 
Michael Collins, thanks for an incredible interview.  I agree with Buliosi.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>rosemarie jackowski, I always love your writing and insight.  Didn&#8217;t realize you ran for office last go round.  Though you didn&#8217;t get in, I&#8217;m sure you made a difference, planting seeds.<br />
Michael Collins, thanks for an incredible interview.  I agree with Buliosi.</p>
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		<title>By: Andres Kargar</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/04/murder-trumps-torture-says-bugliosi/#comment-42839</link>
		<dc:creator>Andres Kargar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 06:27:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dissidentvoice.org/?p=7620#comment-42839</guid>
		<description>The Bush regime has our hands all bloodied and dishonored the country, and in so doing, they have taken the lives of thousands of American and Iraqi citizens.

The only way for us to  redeem ourselves and make sure such crimes will never again be committed by any future US administrations is to put the bastards on trial.

Imagine if Hitler was allowed to quietly go back to his village in Austria...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Bush regime has our hands all bloodied and dishonored the country, and in so doing, they have taken the lives of thousands of American and Iraqi citizens.</p>
<p>The only way for us to  redeem ourselves and make sure such crimes will never again be committed by any future US administrations is to put the bastards on trial.</p>
<p>Imagine if Hitler was allowed to quietly go back to his village in Austria&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Collins</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/04/murder-trumps-torture-says-bugliosi/#comment-42823</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Collins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 01:04:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dissidentvoice.org/?p=7620#comment-42823</guid>
		<description>rosmarie, thanks for running for Vermont Attorney General and getting the word out.  You and Dennett got almot 9% of the vote.  It looks like the problem is 74% for Sorrell, the Democrat.  He coasted obviously so why would he rock the board.  Prosecuting Bush wasn&#039;t the main issue, I suspect, so that&#039;s not a test.  Actually, the real test is should it be done, is it a crime.  My understanding is that per capita, Vermont leads the nation in Iraq War losses.  That&#039;s just appalling.  There should be justice.  But it doesn&#039;t sound like that&#039;s where it will start.

Ron, you remind me of a protest parade picture with marchers carrying this sign: &quot;No matter who you elect, you can&#039;t govern us&quot; (or something close.  That&#039;s the only option, as you outline it.  I agree that elections are really selections.  The money runs the show, the media determines the dialog, and the corporations count votes in secret and come up with &quot;acceptable&quot; results.  It&#039;s largely a show and pretense.   Over 50% of the public lacked confidence in the 2004 presidential results (by 2006) but even if Kerry had one, it would have been the same -- fight a smarter war.  Amazing charade carried on for decades; people underestimate the power of the puppeteers.

Antonio you speak the language of the rulers.  When something goes right it&#039;s &quot;them.&quot;  When it goes wrong, it&#039;s all of us.  Nonsense.  We&#039;re not ruled by those we elect and we&#039;re not given a real choice, no matter what we do.   Name a country and you can name a crime.  But name a country where the vast majority committed or endorsed the crime with full knowledge about that crime and I&#039;ll send you a Franklin.  It&#039;s &quot;&quot;Us&quot; (the people) versus &quot;Them&quot; (The Money Party - rulers and their minions).  When you lump us with them, you both make a big mistake and allow the manipulators to say, &quot;Look, they hate us for our freedoms&quot; as a means to divide the people.  

&lt;blockquote&gt;
The Money Party (5):  &quot;Us&quot; Versus &quot;Them&quot;
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0803/S00402.htm

We have been warned again and again that seeing the world as an &quot;us versus them&quot; proposition is a fatal error. It&#039;s polarizing. It leads to &quot;class warfare.&quot; It absolves &quot;us&quot; of the collective responsibility we all have in a democracy. Can&#039;t have it, not allowed.

Well, here&#039;s some news for &quot;them&quot;. It is precisely an &quot;us versus them&quot; world. We live in a nation where tremendous wealth calls the shots without respect or regard for the public will, fails miserably again and again, and then hides behind &quot;collective responsibility.&quot; We&#039;re supposed to believe that somehow &quot;we all allowed this to happen.&quot;

This point is critical: If &quot;we&quot; all allowed it to happen then &quot;they&quot; aren&#039;t responsible, ever. They have the ultimate &quot;Get out of jail free&quot; card. Kill, maim, steal, lie, cheat, etc. etc. and all they have to do is say everyone was in on it; therefore, they are not responsible. Starting a war based on lies that breaks the bank of the federal budget while the richest 1% get tax cuts is just one example of the fraud perpetrated by our &quot;public servants.&quot; Did you have anything to do with that? &lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>rosmarie, thanks for running for Vermont Attorney General and getting the word out.  You and Dennett got almot 9% of the vote.  It looks like the problem is 74% for Sorrell, the Democrat.  He coasted obviously so why would he rock the board.  Prosecuting Bush wasn&#8217;t the main issue, I suspect, so that&#8217;s not a test.  Actually, the real test is should it be done, is it a crime.  My understanding is that per capita, Vermont leads the nation in Iraq War losses.  That&#8217;s just appalling.  There should be justice.  But it doesn&#8217;t sound like that&#8217;s where it will start.</p>
<p>Ron, you remind me of a protest parade picture with marchers carrying this sign: &#8220;No matter who you elect, you can&#8217;t govern us&#8221; (or something close.  That&#8217;s the only option, as you outline it.  I agree that elections are really selections.  The money runs the show, the media determines the dialog, and the corporations count votes in secret and come up with &#8220;acceptable&#8221; results.  It&#8217;s largely a show and pretense.   Over 50% of the public lacked confidence in the 2004 presidential results (by 2006) but even if Kerry had one, it would have been the same &#8212; fight a smarter war.  Amazing charade carried on for decades; people underestimate the power of the puppeteers.</p>
<p>Antonio you speak the language of the rulers.  When something goes right it&#8217;s &#8220;them.&#8221;  When it goes wrong, it&#8217;s all of us.  Nonsense.  We&#8217;re not ruled by those we elect and we&#8217;re not given a real choice, no matter what we do.   Name a country and you can name a crime.  But name a country where the vast majority committed or endorsed the crime with full knowledge about that crime and I&#8217;ll send you a Franklin.  It&#8217;s &#8220;&#8221;Us&#8221; (the people) versus &#8220;Them&#8221; (The Money Party &#8211; rulers and their minions).  When you lump us with them, you both make a big mistake and allow the manipulators to say, &#8220;Look, they hate us for our freedoms&#8221; as a means to divide the people.  </p>
<blockquote><p>
The Money Party (5):  &#8220;Us&#8221; Versus &#8220;Them&#8221;<br />
<a href="http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0803/S00402.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0803/S00402.htm</a></p>
<p>We have been warned again and again that seeing the world as an &#8220;us versus them&#8221; proposition is a fatal error. It&#8217;s polarizing. It leads to &#8220;class warfare.&#8221; It absolves &#8220;us&#8221; of the collective responsibility we all have in a democracy. Can&#8217;t have it, not allowed.</p>
<p>Well, here&#8217;s some news for &#8220;them&#8221;. It is precisely an &#8220;us versus them&#8221; world. We live in a nation where tremendous wealth calls the shots without respect or regard for the public will, fails miserably again and again, and then hides behind &#8220;collective responsibility.&#8221; We&#8217;re supposed to believe that somehow &#8220;we all allowed this to happen.&#8221;</p>
<p>This point is critical: If &#8220;we&#8221; all allowed it to happen then &#8220;they&#8221; aren&#8217;t responsible, ever. They have the ultimate &#8220;Get out of jail free&#8221; card. Kill, maim, steal, lie, cheat, etc. etc. and all they have to do is say everyone was in on it; therefore, they are not responsible. Starting a war based on lies that breaks the bank of the federal budget while the richest 1% get tax cuts is just one example of the fraud perpetrated by our &#8220;public servants.&#8221; Did you have anything to do with that? </p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Ron Horn</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/04/murder-trumps-torture-says-bugliosi/#comment-42815</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Horn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 22:33:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dissidentvoice.org/?p=7620#comment-42815</guid>
		<description>I think that if one understands that we in the capitalist countries live in a carefully managed political system that is designed to &quot;elect&quot; only those who will serve at the behest of the ruling class, then one can never expect to prosecute any officials regardless of their crimes.  The fact that Bush and Cheney, who committed some of the most heinous crimes  in history and will not be prosecuted, proves my point.   

We have class rule, boy and girls--get over it or change the system which gives the ruling class overwhelming power by virtue of its &quot;ownership&quot; of our economy.  Isn&#039;t it obvious that their anemic version of democracy only serves to provide a fig leaf to hide the obscenity of their dictatorship?  Isn&#039;t obvious that voting every four years for candidates selected by them is not rule &quot;by, for, and of the people&quot;?   Is it really too difficult to  grasp the fact that an economy, like all institutions of a society, is really a legacy handed down to us by eons of generations and cannot be considered the private property of anybody?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that if one understands that we in the capitalist countries live in a carefully managed political system that is designed to &#8220;elect&#8221; only those who will serve at the behest of the ruling class, then one can never expect to prosecute any officials regardless of their crimes.  The fact that Bush and Cheney, who committed some of the most heinous crimes  in history and will not be prosecuted, proves my point.   </p>
<p>We have class rule, boy and girls&#8211;get over it or change the system which gives the ruling class overwhelming power by virtue of its &#8220;ownership&#8221; of our economy.  Isn&#8217;t it obvious that their anemic version of democracy only serves to provide a fig leaf to hide the obscenity of their dictatorship?  Isn&#8217;t obvious that voting every four years for candidates selected by them is not rule &#8220;by, for, and of the people&#8221;?   Is it really too difficult to  grasp the fact that an economy, like all institutions of a society, is really a legacy handed down to us by eons of generations and cannot be considered the private property of anybody?</p>
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		<title>By: Antonio Gonzalez</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/04/murder-trumps-torture-says-bugliosi/#comment-42812</link>
		<dc:creator>Antonio Gonzalez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 21:29:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dissidentvoice.org/?p=7620#comment-42812</guid>
		<description>That is nor bush crime. That is americans people crime. No way, for all
the world America is a criminal country, because the people never say
no to the goverment crime, the americans people believe they can kill
in other countries and only God can prosecute that.
Then never you can see Bush, Cheney, Runsfeld , Powell and other, all
they war criminals and genocide go to the court.
Obama, remember he is a musulman renegade, and he can not change
nothing, because he love the presidency.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That is nor bush crime. That is americans people crime. No way, for all<br />
the world America is a criminal country, because the people never say<br />
no to the goverment crime, the americans people believe they can kill<br />
in other countries and only God can prosecute that.<br />
Then never you can see Bush, Cheney, Runsfeld , Powell and other, all<br />
they war criminals and genocide go to the court.<br />
Obama, remember he is a musulman renegade, and he can not change<br />
nothing, because he love the presidency.</p>
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		<title>By: rosemarie jackowski</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/04/murder-trumps-torture-says-bugliosi/#comment-42795</link>
		<dc:creator>rosemarie jackowski</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 17:27:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dissidentvoice.org/?p=7620#comment-42795</guid>
		<description>During the last election campaign, there were 2 candidates for Vermont Attorney General, who promised to prosecute Bush for murder. The Bugliosi book was the basis for the need to prosecute.  Both candidates lost. I was one of those who lost that election.  The voters either do not want prosecution or are misinformed about the facts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>During the last election campaign, there were 2 candidates for Vermont Attorney General, who promised to prosecute Bush for murder. The Bugliosi book was the basis for the need to prosecute.  Both candidates lost. I was one of those who lost that election.  The voters either do not want prosecution or are misinformed about the facts.</p>
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