Comments on: U.S. Military Base in Vicenza, Italy Gets Final Approval http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/ a radical newsletter in the struggle for peace and social justice Thu, 08 Dec 2011 15:07:30 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Entrogenesis http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39735 Entrogenesis Fri, 27 Feb 2009 19:54:06 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39735 E-Liz My brother and many others in my family have served in the military and I have met many military people in the course of my work, and most of them have had a profound respect for life, especially some I have met who did their killing on the ground rather than from the air. I suppose I should be glad that an admitted potential sociopath is safely stationed (hopefully) thousands of miles away from me, but I wonder when your commanders will see fit to have bombs dropped on neighborhoods here in the good old USA that need their gene pools cleaned out. It's probably my ridiculous regard for life that leads me to disagree with you, a self-styled "cold blooded killer" , who believes that dropping bombs on civilian targets is good for the gene pool, I can already see you whooping it up as you drop a smart bomb on some terrorists in Dayton, Ohio or god knows where. Live by the sword, die by the sword. You may be proud of all the dead people your armies have made, the only thing they are good at making, but the bones of your victims cry out for justice, and your murderous ways will damn all of your countrymen before long. I do not support you or your mission, and your response to my first comment only strengthens my belief in the evil of war and those who glory in it. But hey, you might be a ruthless bloodletter, but at least your husband's well in line. That much is a laugh, at least. E-Liz

My brother and many others in my family have served in the military and I have met many military people in the course of my work, and most of them have had a profound respect for life, especially some I have met who did their killing on the ground rather than from the air.

I suppose I should be glad that an admitted potential sociopath is safely stationed (hopefully) thousands of miles away from me, but I wonder when your commanders will see fit to have bombs dropped on neighborhoods here in the good old USA that need their gene pools cleaned out.

It’s probably my ridiculous regard for life that leads me to disagree with you, a self-styled “cold blooded killer” , who believes that dropping bombs on civilian targets is good for the gene pool, I can already see you whooping it up as you drop a smart bomb on some terrorists in Dayton, Ohio or god knows where.

Live by the sword, die by the sword. You may be proud of all the dead people your armies have made, the only thing they are good at making, but the bones of your victims cry out for justice, and your murderous ways will damn all of your countrymen before long. I do not support you or your mission, and your response to my first comment only strengthens my belief in the evil of war and those who glory in it. But hey, you might be a ruthless bloodletter, but at least your husband’s well in line.

That much is a laugh, at least.

]]> By: E-Liz http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39717 E-Liz Fri, 27 Feb 2009 16:41:17 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39717 I wonder if you have children and how you would feel to have some raving sociopath proudly dropping bombs on them from a comfortable height before going back to base to enjoy a good night’s sleep. That the hand which drops the bombs is female makes little difference…a killer is a killer is a killer. At this point, I would ordinarily ask if you ever knew anyone in the military. However, from reading your post I feel that this would be a profound waste of time. Not I or anyone I know ever dropped on a child, unless that child was living in a military target or a civilian command and control target. If they were, good, we need to get those dumb bastards out of the gene pool anyway. We gave up pattern bombing in the seventies. Sociopath maybe raving not hardly. My husband tells me that I am a cold-blooded killer, I kind of like that it keeps him walking the straight and narrow. As for someone dropping of my kids if I had any. Well that’s the best part of being an American we don’t have to worry about that. We own the sky!! I wonder if you have children and how you would feel to have some raving sociopath proudly dropping bombs on them from a comfortable height before going back to base to enjoy a good night’s sleep. That the hand which drops the bombs is female makes little difference…a killer is a killer is a killer.

At this point, I would ordinarily ask if you ever knew anyone in the military. However, from reading your post I feel that this would be a profound waste of time. Not I or anyone I know ever dropped on a child, unless that child was living in a military target or a civilian command and control target. If they were, good, we need to get those dumb bastards out of the gene pool anyway. We gave up pattern bombing in the seventies.

Sociopath maybe raving not hardly. My husband tells me that I am a cold-blooded killer, I kind of like that it keeps him walking the straight and narrow.

As for someone dropping of my kids if I had any. Well that’s the best part of being an American we don’t have to worry about that. We own the sky!!

]]> By: Entrogenesis http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39692 Entrogenesis Fri, 27 Feb 2009 03:08:57 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39692 E-Liz, I could care less what gender you are, but it is obvious that you care little for those who have been on the business end of your beloved warbird. No matter how innacurate some commenters may have been in their understanding of the locations of various aircraft, the larger point to me seems to be that ordinary Italians are sick of being a province of an Empire dedicated to the worship of all manner of mechanized destruction. I wonder if you have children and how you would feel to have some raving sociopath proudly dropping bombs on them from a comfortable height before going back to base to enjoy a good night's sleep. That the hand which drops the bombs is female makes little difference...a killer is a killer is a killer. E-Liz, I could care less what gender you are, but it is obvious that you care little for those who have been on the business end of your beloved warbird. No matter how innacurate some commenters may have been in their understanding of the locations of various aircraft, the larger point to me seems to be that ordinary Italians are sick of being a province of an Empire dedicated to the worship of all manner of mechanized destruction. I wonder if you have children and how you would feel to have some raving sociopath proudly dropping bombs on them from a comfortable height before going back to base to enjoy a good night’s sleep. That the hand which drops the bombs is female makes little difference…a killer is a killer is a killer.

]]> By: stasicana http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39553 stasicana Wed, 25 Feb 2009 16:18:26 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39553 Pretty soon these bases will be the only territory these clowns will have . . . they'll have to flee to Israel. Pretty soon these bases will be the only territory these clowns will have . . . they’ll have to flee to Israel.

]]> By: Scott Harmon http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39534 Scott Harmon Wed, 25 Feb 2009 04:53:53 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39534 Pelosi needs to get some of that spackling off the face and listen up: the Great Game is so out of date and impractical. We are being led around by our collective nose to protect the Europeans from the Big Bear, and we are acting like we have the money and resources to do it. It is over. Better that we just consolidate within our own region, and leave the economic/demographic forces do what they will in the other regions. Europe is simply a ball and chain, and would be useless to us except for the elitist ties to the banking institutions. Time for a remake. We've got so much more in our own hemisphere. Pelosi needs to get some of that spackling off the face and listen up: the Great Game is so out of date and impractical. We are being led around by our collective nose to protect the Europeans from the Big Bear, and we are acting like we have the money and resources to do it. It is over. Better that we just consolidate within our own region, and leave the economic/demographic forces do what they will in the other regions. Europe is simply a ball and chain, and would be useless to us except for the elitist ties to the banking institutions. Time for a remake. We’ve got so much more in our own hemisphere.

]]> By: Tree http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39510 Tree Tue, 24 Feb 2009 23:49:21 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39510 E-Liz, do you write for the New Yorker? You're a regular Dorothy Parker. E-Liz, do you write for the New Yorker? You’re a regular Dorothy Parker.

]]> By: E-Liz http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39508 E-Liz Tue, 24 Feb 2009 23:04:43 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39508 Sorry everyone I was so mad i did not proof a everything I wrote. nothing pisses me off more that some pig thinking that a sweet little ol girl can't possible fly the hottest warbird in the world. Sorry everyone I was so mad i did not proof a everything I wrote. nothing pisses me off more that some pig thinking that a sweet little ol girl can’t possible fly the hottest warbird in the world.

]]> By: E-Liz http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39506 E-Liz Tue, 24 Feb 2009 22:59:30 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39506 Mr. kenny, You are such a dumbass, # 1 what makes you automaticly think I am a guy? Are that much of a f****** pig that you think only a man can fly this beast? #2 Vicenza is an ARMY base it wil contain the 173 Airborne Infantry Brigade. #3 Anyone in the military can post or say anything we (except classifed stuff of course) but for your fucking information we are Americans also. my Husband posts here all the time. And as for information being kept secret, the following is from google. it shows that there are 21 no 20 and they are all at Whiteman as I said I have also included the names of the ships and some of the call signs. and date of delevery Air Vehicle Aircraft # Name [*] Ordered Delivered to USAF Arrived Whiteman AV- 1 82-1066 Fatal Beauty n/a 17 Jul 89 AV- 2 82-1067 Spirit of ARIZONA Ship From Hell [Murphy's Law] n/a 19 Oct 90 20 Mar 98 AV- 3 82-1068 Spirit of NEW YORK Navigator / Ghost [Afternoon Delight] n/a 18 Jun 91 10 Oct 97 AV- 4 82-1069 Spirit of INDIANA Christine n/a 02 Oct 92 22 May 99 AV- 5 82-1070 Spirit of OHIO Fire and Ice [Toad] n/a 05 Oct 92 18 Jul 97 AV- 6 TOV&V 82-1071 Spirit of MISSISSIPPI Black Widow / Penguin [Arnold the Pig] n/a 02 Feb 93 23 May 98 AV- 7 88-0328 Spirit of TEXAS Pirate Ship 1987 29 Aug 94 31 Aug 94 AV- 8 88-0329 Spirit of MISSOURI 1987 11 Dec 93 17 Dec 93 AV- 9 88-0330 Spirit of CALIFORNIA 1988 16 Aug 94 17 Aug 94 AV-10 88-0331 Spirit of S. CAROLINA 1988 29 Dec 94 30 Dec 94 AV-11 88-0332 Spirit of WASHINGTON 1989 27 Oct 94 30 Oct 94 AV-12 89-0127 Spirit of KANSAS 1989 16 Feb 95 17 Feb 95 AV-13 89-0128 Spirit of NEBRASKA 1990 26 Jun 95 28 Jun 95 AV-14 89-0129 Spirit of GEORGIA 1990 25 Sep 95 14 Nov 95 AV-15 90-0040 Spirit of ALASKA 1991 12 Jan 95 24 Jan 96 AV-16 90-0041 Spirit of HAWAII 1991 21 Dec 95 10 Jan 96 AV-17 92-0700 Spirit of FLORIDA 1992 29 Mar 96 3 Jul 96 AV-18 93-1085 Spirit of OKLAHOMA 1993 13 May 96 15 May 96 AV-19 93-1086 Spirit of KITTY HAWK 1993 30 Aug 96 AV-20 93-1087 Spirit of PENNSYLVANIA 1993 05 Aug 97 AV-21 93-1088 Spirit of LOUISIANA Mr. kenny,
You are such a dumbass,
# 1 what makes you automaticly think I am a guy? Are that much of a f****** pig that you think only a man can fly this beast?

#2 Vicenza is an ARMY base it wil contain the 173 Airborne Infantry Brigade.

#3 Anyone in the military can post or say anything we (except classifed stuff of course) but for your fucking information we are Americans also.
my Husband posts here all the time.

And as for information being kept secret, the following is from google.
it shows that there are 21 no 20 and they are all at Whiteman as I said

I have also included the names of the ships and some of the call signs. and date of delevery

Air Vehicle Aircraft # Name [*] Ordered Delivered to USAF Arrived
Whiteman
AV- 1 82-1066 Fatal Beauty n/a 17 Jul 89
AV- 2 82-1067 Spirit of ARIZONA
Ship From Hell
[Murphy's Law] n/a 19 Oct 90 20 Mar 98
AV- 3 82-1068 Spirit of NEW YORK
Navigator / Ghost
[Afternoon Delight] n/a 18 Jun 91 10 Oct 97
AV- 4 82-1069 Spirit of INDIANA
Christine n/a 02 Oct 92 22 May 99
AV- 5 82-1070 Spirit of OHIO
Fire and Ice [Toad] n/a 05 Oct 92 18 Jul 97
AV- 6 TOV&V 82-1071 Spirit of MISSISSIPPI
Black Widow / Penguin
[Arnold the Pig] n/a 02 Feb 93 23 May 98
AV- 7 88-0328 Spirit of TEXAS
Pirate Ship 1987 29 Aug 94 31 Aug 94
AV- 8 88-0329 Spirit of MISSOURI 1987 11 Dec 93 17 Dec 93
AV- 9 88-0330 Spirit of CALIFORNIA 1988 16 Aug 94 17 Aug 94
AV-10 88-0331 Spirit of S. CAROLINA 1988 29 Dec 94 30 Dec 94
AV-11 88-0332 Spirit of WASHINGTON 1989 27 Oct 94 30 Oct 94
AV-12 89-0127 Spirit of KANSAS 1989 16 Feb 95 17 Feb 95
AV-13 89-0128 Spirit of NEBRASKA 1990 26 Jun 95 28 Jun 95
AV-14 89-0129 Spirit of GEORGIA 1990 25 Sep 95 14 Nov 95
AV-15 90-0040 Spirit of ALASKA 1991 12 Jan 95 24 Jan 96
AV-16 90-0041 Spirit of HAWAII 1991 21 Dec 95 10 Jan 96
AV-17 92-0700 Spirit of FLORIDA 1992 29 Mar 96 3 Jul 96
AV-18 93-1085 Spirit of OKLAHOMA 1993 13 May 96 15 May 96
AV-19 93-1086 Spirit of KITTY HAWK 1993 30 Aug 96
AV-20 93-1087 Spirit of PENNSYLVANIA 1993 05 Aug 97
AV-21 93-1088 Spirit of LOUISIANA

]]> By: Michael Kenny http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39502 Michael Kenny Tue, 24 Feb 2009 22:18:56 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39502 My understanding is that the entire surviving fleet of 20 B2s are based in Ramstein and I doubt if the US Air Force will tell us one way or another! The thing I loved about E-Liz's comment is how it demonstrates exactly what I was saying about Vicenza being a PR disaster for the US. On the one hand, he tried to sidetrack the debate into a discussion of where some bombers were based, as if that mattered a damn, but in so doing, put his foot squarely in it by raising the bombing of Serbian civilians and the expulsion of the population of the British island of Diego Garcia, who recently won the right to go back to their homes in the English courts! Naturally, nobody beleives that the US will comply the Court's decision! Notice also the use of "we", as if he was part of the USAF. Nobody in the military would be foolish enough to post a message in such arrogant terms on a politically sensitive subject or blab on the internet about where this or that type of aircraft is based and how they get from A to B! Indeed, I am often intrigued by the fact that Ms Westbrook carefully avoids any direct criticism of the US Government or the USAF. You'd expect her to lambaste them both. There's another slice of PR disaster for you! My understanding is that the entire surviving fleet of 20 B2s are based in Ramstein and I doubt if the US Air Force will tell us one way or another!

The thing I loved about E-Liz’s comment is how it demonstrates exactly what I was saying about Vicenza being a PR disaster for the US. On the one hand, he tried to sidetrack the debate into a discussion of where some bombers were based, as if that mattered a damn, but in so doing, put his foot squarely in it by raising the bombing of Serbian civilians and the expulsion of the population of the British island of Diego Garcia, who recently won the right to go back to their homes in the English courts! Naturally, nobody beleives that the US will comply the Court’s decision!

Notice also the use of “we”, as if he was part of the USAF. Nobody in the military would be foolish enough to post a message in such arrogant terms on a politically sensitive subject or blab on the internet about where this or that type of aircraft is based and how they get from A to B!

Indeed, I am often intrigued by the fact that Ms Westbrook carefully avoids any direct criticism of the US Government or the USAF. You’d expect her to lambaste them both. There’s another slice of PR disaster for you!

]]> By: E-Liz http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39499 E-Liz Tue, 24 Feb 2009 21:59:20 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39499 Mr. Kenny seems to have Ranstein and Rhine-main a bit confused. Mr. Kenny seems to have Ranstein and Rhine-main a bit confused.

]]> By: Murray Rothbard http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39498 Murray Rothbard Tue, 24 Feb 2009 21:57:18 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39498 The country's bankrupt and our rulers are STILL building more foreign imperial bases?! Long Live Obama the Warmonger!! The country’s bankrupt and our rulers are STILL building more foreign imperial bases?! Long Live Obama the Warmonger!!

]]> By: America Right Or Wrong http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39494 America Right Or Wrong Tue, 24 Feb 2009 21:05:09 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39494 Finally! Now Italy can finally see who their overlords truly are. Finally! Now Italy can finally see who their overlords truly are.

]]> By: End the Empire http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39491 End the Empire Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:30:07 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39491 We are tired of borrowing money from the Chinese and the Arabs to fund our empire on the back of future generations of Americans. Its unfair to saddle these future Americans with 65 trillion in unfunded liabilities just so we can buy McMansions and Hummers. Start wars so our defense stocks rise. The US Government is completely out of control. The States need to reasert their role in the administration of the country. We are tired of borrowing money from the Chinese and the Arabs to fund our empire on the back of future generations of Americans. Its unfair to saddle these future Americans with 65 trillion in unfunded liabilities just so we can buy McMansions and Hummers. Start wars so our defense stocks rise. The US Government is completely out of control. The States need to reasert their role in the administration of the country.

]]> By: Steven http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39490 Steven Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:29:39 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39490 Rhein Main was closed as of Dec 2005. B-2s are only based in the US. Rhein Main was closed as of Dec 2005. B-2s are only based in the US.

]]> By: Bryan Morton http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39486 Bryan Morton Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:36:43 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39486 "We flew raids into Serbia with two crews, so one crew could get a good nights sleep while the other crew dropped smart bombs and then the crew who was rested flew home. 20k miles for a round trip is not that hard to do." I suppose you could sleep after murdering civilians ... if you have no morals or conscience. Ah, Diego Garcia ... I would urge everyone to study the history of the Chagos. A good place to start is the Youtube video, "Stealing a Nation." You also have to love Pelosi's rose colored glasses with optional blinders. “We flew raids into Serbia with two crews, so one crew could get a good nights sleep while the other crew dropped smart bombs and then the crew who was rested flew home. 20k miles for a round trip is not that hard to do.”

I suppose you could sleep after murdering civilians … if you have no morals or conscience.

Ah, Diego Garcia … I would urge everyone to study the history of the Chagos. A good place to start is the Youtube video, “Stealing a Nation.”

You also have to love Pelosi’s rose colored glasses with optional blinders.

]]> By: Lysander Spooner http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39480 Lysander Spooner Tue, 24 Feb 2009 18:11:24 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39480 Hooray, another black hole to pour US taxpayer money down. Long live FREEDOM, may the EMPIRE perish soon like all that came before. Hooray, another black hole to pour US taxpayer money down.

Long live FREEDOM, may the EMPIRE perish soon like all that came before.

]]> By: Al http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39474 Al Tue, 24 Feb 2009 17:30:14 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39474 Just another day in the life of American Military Industrial Complex hegemony. End this bloody world empire now before it ends the U.S. Just another day in the life of American Military Industrial Complex hegemony.
End this bloody world empire now before it ends the U.S.

]]> By: Jay Janson http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39431 Jay Janson Tue, 24 Feb 2009 02:18:38 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39431 Stephanie, what is the rationale or pretext for justifying the expense of these bases in Italy? And or purpose or imagined future use of such military instalations? Stephanie, what is the rationale or pretext for justifying the expense of these bases in Italy?
And or purpose or imagined future use of such military instalations?

]]> By: E-Liz http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39426 E-Liz Tue, 24 Feb 2009 01:42:48 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39426 Sorry Mr. Kenny, All the B-2s and B-1s are at Whiteman AFB in Mo. There are no forward deployed Bombers in the USAF, All the Bombing missions during the whole south Asia campaign were flown from Whiteman, Staged out of either Barksdale La. or Diego Garcia. That’s what makes us the United States Air Force we have the ability to reach out and touch someone, We flew raids into Serbia with two crews, so one crew could get a good nights sleep while the other crew dropped smart bombs and then the crew who was rested flew home. 20k miles for a round trip is not that hard to do. Sorry Mr. Kenny,

All the B-2s and B-1s are at Whiteman AFB in Mo. There are no forward deployed Bombers in the USAF, All the Bombing missions during the whole south Asia campaign were flown from Whiteman, Staged out of either Barksdale La. or Diego Garcia.

That’s what makes us the United States Air Force we have the ability to reach out and touch someone, We flew raids into Serbia with two crews, so one crew could get a good nights sleep while the other crew dropped smart bombs and then the crew who was rested flew home. 20k miles for a round trip is not that hard to do.

]]> By: Michael Kenny http://dissidentvoice.org/2009/02/us-military-base-in-vicenza-italy-gets-final-approval/#comment-39411 Michael Kenny Mon, 23 Feb 2009 21:18:36 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=6883#comment-39411 The amusing part of all of this is that it is an enormous PR disaster for the US in Europe. Incidentally, US air bases on the same site as civilian airports are not unknown. Rhein-Main AFB in Frankfurt is on the same site as one of Europe's biggerst civilian airports and uses the same runways. I would guess that the purpose of the Vicenza works is to move the surviving 20 B2 bombers from Ramstein down to Vicenza, from whence they have access to the open sea and thereby, to Israel. (We all know what NATO's function is!) At that point, Rhine-Main might be closed, since just about everything there is open to public gaze, whereas Ramstein is well fenced off The amusing part of all of this is that it is an enormous PR disaster for the US in Europe.

Incidentally, US air bases on the same site as civilian airports are not unknown. Rhein-Main AFB in Frankfurt is on the same site as one of Europe’s biggerst civilian airports and uses the same runways. I would guess that the purpose of the Vicenza works is to move the surviving 20 B2 bombers from Ramstein down to Vicenza, from whence they have access to the open sea and thereby, to Israel. (We all know what NATO’s function is!) At that point, Rhine-Main might be closed, since just about everything there is open to public gaze, whereas Ramstein is well fenced off

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