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	<title>Comments on: Bernie Madoff (actually pronounced made-off)</title>
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		<title>By: giorgio</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34850</link>
		<dc:creator>giorgio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 11:44:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34850</guid>
		<description>“They thought Bernie Madoff was a genius, and anybody who didn’t give them their money was a fool.”’ 

So they thought Hitler was a GENIUS, until he hit the brickwall...
Who the new geniuses for 2009? Any guesses?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“They thought Bernie Madoff was a genius, and anybody who didn’t give them their money was a fool.”’ </p>
<p>So they thought Hitler was a GENIUS, until he hit the brickwall&#8230;<br />
Who the new geniuses for 2009? Any guesses?</p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34697</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 14:44:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34697</guid>
		<description>Muhammed Rafeeq&#039;s perspective(by way of Kahar) on this affair is interesting but not wholly correct. 

While it is true investors will be able to fill a claim with the SEC, under the fraud protection fund. It is rather unrealistic to believe that anyone would come out with more than a couple of pennies on the dollar. 

I understand that the total amount available in the fund to be around $1.5 billion , a small fraction of the reported total of $50 billion stolen.  And the Madoff investors would only be entitled to a small portion of that amount. 

So it&#039;s hard to imagine anyone being made whole in the process.  Even the &quot;lucky&quot; few who withdrew they money before the collapse, won&#039;t get to keep they&#039;re money.  The Federal Bankruptcy Court will recapture those dollars, and disperse them to the other victims proportionally.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Muhammed Rafeeq&#8217;s perspective(by way of Kahar) on this affair is interesting but not wholly correct. </p>
<p>While it is true investors will be able to fill a claim with the SEC, under the fraud protection fund. It is rather unrealistic to believe that anyone would come out with more than a couple of pennies on the dollar. </p>
<p>I understand that the total amount available in the fund to be around $1.5 billion , a small fraction of the reported total of $50 billion stolen.  And the Madoff investors would only be entitled to a small portion of that amount. </p>
<p>So it&#8217;s hard to imagine anyone being made whole in the process.  Even the &#8220;lucky&#8221; few who withdrew they money before the collapse, won&#8217;t get to keep they&#8217;re money.  The Federal Bankruptcy Court will recapture those dollars, and disperse them to the other victims proportionally.</p>
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		<title>By: MrCynic3</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34535</link>
		<dc:creator>MrCynic3</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Dec 2008 13:17:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34535</guid>
		<description>Kahar quoting the excellent article by Rafeeq in global research website
has hit the nail on the head. I agree with him 100%. 
Yes, this is a case  of hedge fund that went bankrupt and its failure was
claimed to be a Ponzi scheme in order for everyone to get compensation.
Just wait and see every one of those &quot;schmucks&quot; will get his money back.
Fifty billions dollar is a small chage compared to the trillions shelled
out by the taxpayers in the bail-out shenanigans.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kahar quoting the excellent article by Rafeeq in global research website<br />
has hit the nail on the head. I agree with him 100%.<br />
Yes, this is a case  of hedge fund that went bankrupt and its failure was<br />
claimed to be a Ponzi scheme in order for everyone to get compensation.<br />
Just wait and see every one of those &#8220;schmucks&#8221; will get his money back.<br />
Fifty billions dollar is a small chage compared to the trillions shelled<br />
out by the taxpayers in the bail-out shenanigans.</p>
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		<title>By: Deadbeat</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34452</link>
		<dc:creator>Deadbeat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Dec 2008 01:45:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34452</guid>
		<description>Thanks Max and I hope you and yours are having a Happy Holiday season.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Max and I hope you and yours are having a Happy Holiday season.</p>
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		<title>By: Max Shields</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34449</link>
		<dc:creator>Max Shields</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Dec 2008 01:02:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34449</guid>
		<description>Good points DB.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good points DB.</p>
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		<title>By: Hue Longer</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34448</link>
		<dc:creator>Hue Longer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Dec 2008 00:27:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34448</guid>
		<description>He robbed from the rich but did he give to the poor?  No?  Then he robbed from the poor...fuck him</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>He robbed from the rich but did he give to the poor?  No?  Then he robbed from the poor&#8230;fuck him</p>
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		<title>By: Deadbeat</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34443</link>
		<dc:creator>Deadbeat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Dec 2008 22:41:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34443</guid>
		<description>A big problem that is not being addressed is that many people are saddle with debt that they cannot get out from under and their are no policies coming from the government that plans to deal with this.  Job &quot;creation&quot; won&#039;t address the debt issue and with the bankruptcy law weakened it will be extremely difficult for many working class families to alleviate themselves from their debt burdens.  The recession (depression) and unemployment will only exacerbate this problem.

The Madoff affair clearly exposed the bullshit the working class (especially so-called &quot;professionals&quot;) were sold when they forfeited unions, defined benefits, pensions, etc for ESOP&#039;s and 401-K&#039;s.  The market was rigged and Madoff, as Nasdaq chairman, clearly demonstrates the fool errand playing the game of Capitalists.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A big problem that is not being addressed is that many people are saddle with debt that they cannot get out from under and their are no policies coming from the government that plans to deal with this.  Job &#8220;creation&#8221; won&#8217;t address the debt issue and with the bankruptcy law weakened it will be extremely difficult for many working class families to alleviate themselves from their debt burdens.  The recession (depression) and unemployment will only exacerbate this problem.</p>
<p>The Madoff affair clearly exposed the bullshit the working class (especially so-called &#8220;professionals&#8221;) were sold when they forfeited unions, defined benefits, pensions, etc for ESOP&#8217;s and 401-K&#8217;s.  The market was rigged and Madoff, as Nasdaq chairman, clearly demonstrates the fool errand playing the game of Capitalists.</p>
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		<title>By: Diane</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34439</link>
		<dc:creator>Diane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Dec 2008 21:59:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34439</guid>
		<description>Muhammed Rafeeq article is excellent as is Hudson&#039;s Wealth creation as a Ponzi scheme also on Global Research, below a quote

&quot;What Ponzi sold was hope, pandering to peoples’ unrealistic desire to believe that a new way to make easy gains had been discovered, with no visible upper limit as to how long gains can persist in excess of the economy’s own rate of growth.&quot;

Kelley indeed seems to have an unrealistic admiration for Madoff, folk hero, my eye. The way through this crisis, is for ordinary people to maintain scepticism and vigilance, the buggers will screw us all over again, if we aren&#039;t watchful, collectively we must not allow the bastards to get away with it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Muhammed Rafeeq article is excellent as is Hudson&#8217;s Wealth creation as a Ponzi scheme also on Global Research, below a quote</p>
<p>&#8220;What Ponzi sold was hope, pandering to peoples’ unrealistic desire to believe that a new way to make easy gains had been discovered, with no visible upper limit as to how long gains can persist in excess of the economy’s own rate of growth.&#8221;</p>
<p>Kelley indeed seems to have an unrealistic admiration for Madoff, folk hero, my eye. The way through this crisis, is for ordinary people to maintain scepticism and vigilance, the buggers will screw us all over again, if we aren&#8217;t watchful, collectively we must not allow the bastards to get away with it.</p>
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		<title>By: Deadbeat</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34428</link>
		<dc:creator>Deadbeat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:23:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34428</guid>
		<description>It would appear that the perspective of the Madoff affair by Muhammad Rafeeq would seem to counter to a particular degree that of James Petras.  It would seem that unlike the set back to Zionism implied by Petras that Zionism from will in fact thrive from the Madoff affair and get fully funded by taxpayers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It would appear that the perspective of the Madoff affair by Muhammad Rafeeq would seem to counter to a particular degree that of James Petras.  It would seem that unlike the set back to Zionism implied by Petras that Zionism from will in fact thrive from the Madoff affair and get fully funded by taxpayers.</p>
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		<title>By: kahar</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34410</link>
		<dc:creator>kahar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Dec 2008 16:26:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34410</guid>
		<description>The above is a very unenlightening article. The &quot;rich (Jewish) schmuks walking around confused&quot; are celebrating indeed. Check out Muhammed Rafeeq&#039;s excellent article on Global Research, this is an excerpt:

&quot;I have acted as a professional consultant to major EC and US financial institutions on corporate and institutional credit risk and the idea that anyone in HSBC or Santander could authorise large investment without the internal checks and controls being employed is almost impossible. To try and believe that EVERY institution that invested in Madoff circumvented their internal control procedures IS impossible.

Why is this important? Simple. If someone approaches the HSBC credit risk team, for instance, with a view to making a loan or investing a sum as large as £600m to what is ultimately a single institution (therefore a single counterparty credit exposure) a significant number hoops would have to be jumped through. Firstly there is the credit officer competence limit, which is the maximum amount that a single credit officer may be allowed to authorise. More than his/her limit must be referred up the credit approval food chain. In an institution like HSBC or Santander etc, £600bn or US$1bn will have been referred to the very top of the food chain, the banks&#039; credit committees at the board level. This is an enormous sum and no lacky is going to be able to approve this by themselves, ever.

... Any company that I have ever worked for would have known internally that such business was being done, because they are all involved.... It is not possible to hide things like this internally for very long, months at the most; 20+ years, NEVER.

So why plead guilty? The answer is simple. Look on the net and you will see that because this case is being labelled a fraud, it would appear that investors are going to be able to claim their investment back under the US government&#039;s financial fraud protection scheme. A judge has already given his approval in principle for compensation, without any evidence having been presented and financial fraud being demonstrated in a court of law. And it would appear that there will never be such a demonstration in a court of law. Why? It would appear that all the funds financial records are mostly &quot;missing&quot; (rather like Dov Zakheim&#039;s US$1.4tn) and those few records that do survive are in a terrible mess.

However, since the guy has pleaded guilty we do not need to demonstrate the fraud, because he says he is guilty.

And look further on the net and you will see that these &quot;victims&quot; have also been told by the US tax authorities that they will probably also be entitled to claim back some taxes on these defrauded sums.

Rather than saying this hedge fund has gone bust, due to its choice of investment assets and investment methologies, a scenario which is highly probable in the current financial paradigm, since all the professionals are predicting that at least 30% of all hedge funds are about to fail, more than 700 of them, the CEO chooses to fess up to fraud. IF THE CEO ADMIST THE FUND HAS GONE BUST, THEN ALL THOSE WEALTHY MEMBERS OF THE JEWISH COMMUNITY GET NOTHING, BUT IF THE CEO ADMIT TO FRAUD THEY GET THE MONEY BACK AS COMPENSATION FROM THE US TAXPAYER, just as they are also drawing money back from the tax payers with the other hand.&quot;

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&amp;code=20081224&amp;articleId=11488</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The above is a very unenlightening article. The &#8220;rich (Jewish) schmuks walking around confused&#8221; are celebrating indeed. Check out Muhammed Rafeeq&#8217;s excellent article on Global Research, this is an excerpt:</p>
<p>&#8220;I have acted as a professional consultant to major EC and US financial institutions on corporate and institutional credit risk and the idea that anyone in HSBC or Santander could authorise large investment without the internal checks and controls being employed is almost impossible. To try and believe that EVERY institution that invested in Madoff circumvented their internal control procedures IS impossible.</p>
<p>Why is this important? Simple. If someone approaches the HSBC credit risk team, for instance, with a view to making a loan or investing a sum as large as £600m to what is ultimately a single institution (therefore a single counterparty credit exposure) a significant number hoops would have to be jumped through. Firstly there is the credit officer competence limit, which is the maximum amount that a single credit officer may be allowed to authorise. More than his/her limit must be referred up the credit approval food chain. In an institution like HSBC or Santander etc, £600bn or US$1bn will have been referred to the very top of the food chain, the banks&#8217; credit committees at the board level. This is an enormous sum and no lacky is going to be able to approve this by themselves, ever.</p>
<p>&#8230; Any company that I have ever worked for would have known internally that such business was being done, because they are all involved&#8230;. It is not possible to hide things like this internally for very long, months at the most; 20+ years, NEVER.</p>
<p>So why plead guilty? The answer is simple. Look on the net and you will see that because this case is being labelled a fraud, it would appear that investors are going to be able to claim their investment back under the US government&#8217;s financial fraud protection scheme. A judge has already given his approval in principle for compensation, without any evidence having been presented and financial fraud being demonstrated in a court of law. And it would appear that there will never be such a demonstration in a court of law. Why? It would appear that all the funds financial records are mostly &#8220;missing&#8221; (rather like Dov Zakheim&#8217;s US$1.4tn) and those few records that do survive are in a terrible mess.</p>
<p>However, since the guy has pleaded guilty we do not need to demonstrate the fraud, because he says he is guilty.</p>
<p>And look further on the net and you will see that these &#8220;victims&#8221; have also been told by the US tax authorities that they will probably also be entitled to claim back some taxes on these defrauded sums.</p>
<p>Rather than saying this hedge fund has gone bust, due to its choice of investment assets and investment methologies, a scenario which is highly probable in the current financial paradigm, since all the professionals are predicting that at least 30% of all hedge funds are about to fail, more than 700 of them, the CEO chooses to fess up to fraud. IF THE CEO ADMIST THE FUND HAS GONE BUST, THEN ALL THOSE WEALTHY MEMBERS OF THE JEWISH COMMUNITY GET NOTHING, BUT IF THE CEO ADMIT TO FRAUD THEY GET THE MONEY BACK AS COMPENSATION FROM THE US TAXPAYER, just as they are also drawing money back from the tax payers with the other hand.&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&#038;code=20081224&#038;articleId=11488" rel="nofollow">http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&#038;code=20081224&#038;articleId=11488</a></p>
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		<title>By: paul</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34397</link>
		<dc:creator>paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Dec 2008 10:33:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34397</guid>
		<description>very well written and informative article
thanks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>very well written and informative article<br />
thanks</p>
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		<title>By: catherine</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34359</link>
		<dc:creator>catherine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Dec 2008 19:59:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=5605#comment-34359</guid>
		<description>This guy has the nerve to walk around New York - with or without a bodyguard, do you know?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This guy has the nerve to walk around New York &#8211; with or without a bodyguard, do you know?</p>
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		<title>By: Deadbeat</title>
		<link>http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/bernie-madoff-actually-pronounced-made-off/#comment-34358</link>
		<dc:creator>Deadbeat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Dec 2008 19:06:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I noticed lately when writers describe Madoff they seem to omit that he was &lt;i&gt;&lt;b&gt;President of the NASDAQ&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/i&gt;.  Why is that?  That is an extremely important description of the man as well as the WHOLE STOCK MARKET.  Nasdaq is one of the most important exchanges.  Companies such as Microsoft (MSFT), GOOGLE (GOOG), and other high tech firms trade on this market.  The Madoff affair and the possibility of that money being embezzled and laundered to Israel calls into question the entire system.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I noticed lately when writers describe Madoff they seem to omit that he was <i><b>President of the NASDAQ</b></i>.  Why is that?  That is an extremely important description of the man as well as the WHOLE STOCK MARKET.  Nasdaq is one of the most important exchanges.  Companies such as Microsoft (MSFT), GOOGLE (GOOG), and other high tech firms trade on this market.  The Madoff affair and the possibility of that money being embezzled and laundered to Israel calls into question the entire system.</p>
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