No I’m not saying that national socialism is any way legitimate and certainly not a legitimate part of modern socialism. I do want to point out that fascism, is an outgrowth of Marxism/socialism. That was the purpose of as you put it the “quotation fest”.

The realities of fascism Are too horrible to even contemplate. The evils that Nazism unleashed upon the world changed the fundamental reality of the human race, under no circumstance should the evils and believes of the NAZI party be allowed to exist today tomorrow or ever,

This is the very reason I’m very tired of the left in this country using the term fascist. The vast majority of the left have no clue what a fascist is. If George bush and Dick Cheney were Fascist how do you explain the fact that Barak Obama, Keith Oberman, or any one of 100 other left wing politico’s and pundits are still alive. I know you don’t know me from Adam’s off ox but you have to believe I’ve studied NAZI Germany, fascist Italy, Spain Chile and Argentina and I can say with a great deal of certainty that George Bush isn’t a Pimple on Hitler’s ass.

You stated above that a good many of my readers are living under a socialist regime led by bush junior, I myself live in that and I can’t say that it’s a Fascist regime I can’t even say that it’s much of a totalitarian regime, I don’t see any rights that I had eight years ago that are missing today, as far as the bill of rights being shredded, I don’t see that either. I’m sorry Poulu , I am a realist. I know you’re saying he has his head in his ass. But as you know difference of opinion is what makes a horse race.

As for referring to the left in this country as a group of silly bastards, that’s how I see it,you spend helluva lot of time worring about things they can’t be changed, you talk about peace and the brotherhood of man but pretty much that’s all the American left does, talk. I’ve made a study of the articles on dissident voice, seems to me like the vast majority of articles that get attention are all articles having to do with people’s pocketbooks or the American election. I see articles about the Palestinians, the poor Sudanese or south Americans getting no comments, this tells me that the American left don’t give a rats ass about half the things they protest.

Anyway my friend, I think maybe my French friend. This articles is getting buried was in the back of DV. Should you care to discuss this further e-mail me at boonhogganbeck@yahoo.com and I would be happy to discuss these things further in depth with you. Have a wonderful weekend.

Danny

You haven’t answered my questions.

No I am broadly insinuating that “ Socialism” is somehow a LEGITIMATE brand of National socialism??

In a word, horseshit — all of it, front to back.

But then, the McCain rah-rahs have been out in force here lately.

It will gladden the hearts of the far left to hear that OBAMA IS A SOCIALIST …

It very well might, if he truly were. But, sadly, he’s not; not even close.

Are you vaguely insinuating that “National Socialism” is somehow a LEGITIMATE brand of socialism??

And what do Hitler’s ideological proclamations of 1930 — or, for that matter, those of the other Fascist theoreticians ["theologians"??] cited — have to do with the REALITIES of Fascism, as it was practiced? (Hitler, after all, certainly wasn’t above “dirtying his hands” by consorting with the obscenely wealthy capitalists of Germany’s cartels to get himself put into power! And afterwards, in the Night of Long Knives, he simply had those prominent members of the NSDAP who opposed him or his views assasinated en masse. So much for “We National Socialists”, eh?)

There are certainly reams of material available postulating what Fascism was supposed to be. But the modern use of the word derives far more from what it actually was — an unholy marriage of business and government, resulting in a massive loss of liberty for the populace at large. The truest sentiment expressed above, when all was said and done, is thus an abbreviated excerpt of Palmieri’s statement: “Fascism … is the very antithesis of Individualism.”

“Kill all the rich. Break up their cars and apartments. Bring the revolution home. Kill your parents ” …Bill Ayres.

“Tax the Rich”. Spread the wealth around” …Barrak Obama

Ayers confessed to “an undying hatred for America”
Michele Obama called America a “mean country” and said that for “the first time in my adult life I am proud of my country”

“Socialism is the total opposite of capitalism/imperialism. It is the rejection of empire and white supremacy” …Ayres

Obama would bring our troops home in defeat and he obliquely accuses the republicans of racism.

Obama is influenced greatly by his friendship with Ayers and Dohrn. Clearly he ran with that crowd and even spoke in praise of Khalidi, the virulently anti-semetic PLO supporter and close friend of the Ayers.
In Chicago, the Khalidis founded the Arab American Action Network, and Mona Khalidi served as its president. A big farewell dinner was held in their honor by AAAN with a commemorative book filled with testimonials from their friends and political allies. These included the left wing anti-war group Not In My Name, the Electronic Intifada, and the ex-Weatherman domestic terrorists Bernadine Dohrn and Bill Ayers. (There were also testimonials from then-state Senator Barack Obama and the mayor of Chicago.)
His many talks over dinners with the Khalidis, Obama said, had been “consistent reminders to me of my own blind spots and my own biases… It’s for that reason that I’m hoping that, for many years to come, we continue that conversation — a conversation that is necessary not just around Mona and Rashid’s dinner table,” but around “this entire world.” No wonder Hamas and Hezbollah endorse aan Obama presidency.
So again, have the violent socialist policies of the Chicago gang that Obama ran with influenced his politics? Indeed they have. To deny it is absurd.
It will gladden the hearts of the far left to hear that OBAMA IS A SOCIALIST and his presidency would certainly reflect and advance socialism. It should frighten Americans.

http://dissentingjustice.blogspot.com/2008/10/2008-is-not-1964-why-liberals-and.html

http://dissentingjustice.blogspot.com/2008/10/split-ticket-what-californias-battle.html

Adolf Hitler, spoken to Otto Strasser, Berlin, May 21, 1930.
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We National Socialists are enemies, deadly enemies, of the present capitalist system with its exploitation of the economically weak … and we are resolved under all circumstances to destroy this system.

Gregor Strasser, National Socialist theologian…
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Fascism, which is the very antithesis of Individualism, stands as the nemesis of all economic doctrines and all economic practice of both the capitalist and communistic systems.

The Philosophy of Fascism, 1936, by Mario Palmieri, Italy’s foremost fascist theologian.
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As late as 1932, Mussolini acknowledged Fascism’s affinities with Communism: ‘In the whole negative part, we are alike. We and the Russians are against the liberals, against democrats, against parliament’.

Richard Pipes, Russia Under the Bolshevik Regime, 1993.
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[In Mussolini] Socialists should be delighted to find at last a socialist who speaks and thinks as responsible rulers do.
George Bernard Shaw, 1927…
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… better go down with Bolshevism than live in eternal capitalist servitude.
Joseph Goebbels, Diaries…
I must admit that I am not certain of the last quote The one by Gobbels I seem to think that I have seen this same quote by someone else.

Danny Ray: Since your comment is not specifically directed, I have no idea whom you refer to as “silly bastards”. As for myself, I’m quite aware of what Fascism [in practice] implies, and have never used the term lightly. Should you feel a need to review my own definition, see my links to Evie above. I can also direct you to online sources for “Ur-Fascism” — by Umberto Eco, who lived under Italian Fascism — as well as “Mussolin’s” own (admittedly theory-based) “Fascist Manifesto”, among many others, should you so desire.

Just let me know, and I’ll gladly point the way.

Incidentally, I suspect that a good many of the would-be “silly bastards” you hypothesize are actually acutely aware of what a Fascist is, having lived under a regime thoroughly dominated by NeoCoNazis for the past 8 years. While there are always questions of degree in individual case studies regarding the various symptoms expressed, there is little room for doubt that the disease itself has now been forcibly inflicted on Americans.

since you think Obama is not the answer to last 8 years, what makes McCain right? Is it because he’s white?
BEtter yet, have you read his political report card, Might want to do that, then compare the to again.

To me it doesn’t matter a person skin color, or political identy, but his ability, morals, respect and expertise tog et te job done,for we the people who put him in office.

If the term has been plausibly wielded by “so many sides”, I’d say that validates the already stated premise that the US has long been under Fascist rule. The glaring difference under this Bush Reich is that it’s now completely, audaciously out in the open.

“It sounds stupid?” I think not. What it actually sounds is remarkably illustrative of this government’s dramatic devolution under the Bush-Cheney regime. There’s not even a PRETENSE of “representative government” now.

Poilu – The 14 points of fascism has been around and used by so many “sides” that it sounds stupid. More than a decade ago the right-wing swore Bill Clinton was ushering in fascism – which is just government controlled by business which Clinton was as much as Bush is.

We need less government – not more.

Do you understand the concept of the phrase “population as a whole”? Do you understand that the majority decision of a group may be in direct opposition to individual members of that group?

Do you understand the concept of “democracy” and voting within a democratic system? Do you understand that individuals may vote in ways that are opposite to the voting patterns of the majority, but that the majority opinion will rule?

As for the electoral college, it is simply a buffer to ensure that each region of the nation is equally represented based on their populations. Additionally, it is only applicable in presidential elections. Elections for congress are direct counts of the votes and there is no electoral college to serve as a buffer.

If you are an American and you are in opposition to the majority opinion, then I say “Good for you.” However, your individual opposition does not excuse or mitigate the opinions of the majority. There will always be good individuals within an overall corrupt and evil society. Even in Nazi Germany there were good individuals, but that didn’t mean that the population as a whole shouldn’t have been terror-bombed into submission.

If you are arguing that the United States is a dictatorship, in fact if not in law, then you should be arguing with “evie”.