I sent him $100 and received a reply with a picture of him and his wife -then sent him $200 more three days before the primary. I suppose they may or may not have time to thank me again. But the Win was thanks enuf.

I’m about as far as an American citizen can be from supporting the electoral system in Democracy As We Know It, but how insane would any progressive in this country have to be to not support Dennis Kucinich?

Amen.

Dennis is capable of manifesting a whole paradigm that hasn’t even occurred to anyone who has written above. He is VASTLY capable. Do not ever under-estimate him.
And our dear writer above has concluded much praise by calling Dennis a LOSER?
Dennis IS ABSOLUTELY NOT, AND NEVER WAS, AND NEVER WILL BE that. Neither am I so long as I stand with him as I will always, because he inspires joy and light in my heart.
Seeing even a tiny bit of loser in him requires our dear writer above to
“OPEN YOUR EYES!”
He is HUMBLE: Don’t ever mistake humility for being a loser. It takes a vast soul to be humble, not a small one.
And GENTLE?
“Nothing is so strong as gentleness, nothing so gentle as real strength.” (quoted from Saint Francis de Sales)
HIS STRENGTH ASTOUNDS ME.
So, folks, may I invite you to honor your original impulse — that Dennis IS by far the greatest, and know that he CONTINUES to be so. I do believe WE are winning — in ways that are unfolding even as I type this.
Be the WE that is winning! Don’t jump ship!
GO DENNIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jonathan, that is precisely the problem. You “progressives” (which you are not) especially do not like the truth, when it refuses to support your arguments (most of the time), any more than the other side. Almost every article I read on this site, and others, is brimming with falsehoods masquerading as “facts”, and made up “facts” authoritatively told by the big kahoonas of the left (or the pretenders). It would be a full time job for me to read and critique articles just on this site, let alone others. (At least here, comments can be posted, one positive thing).

The reason why you don’t gain any traction is very simple: the American people, for all their uneducated ignorance, have figured you out. They know that you too only care about the money, prestige and power, just like the other side, but the other side is honest about it, they say it outright that they are greedy swine who only care about themselves. You, on the other hand, while being exactly the same inside, think you can snow us with your demagoguery and your high faluting BS.

So, they (the people) have chosen the greedy, selfish swine, because they know what they’re getting, as opposed to a slithering, slimy snake who speaks with a forked tongue.

Perhaps it is because the Kucinich detractions from the left usually have an emotional basis to them. And that emotion is that of betrayal. However since they are of complex nature and not particularly based on reason; it is difficult for one not feeling them to fully understand. Not to say they cannot be reasonable, but the underpinning motive for generating the arguments appears in many cases to be a justification for that emotion.

I reject many of these detracting arguments as being far too critical considering the options available for DK . He has always been penned-in by being a party “faithful” ; even after repeated proofs that the party is not faithful to him. Talk about betrayal… But those are his roots. This is his power-base at home, and his honestly felt beliefs, as i see it, are that the party must be changed from within. Personally, i no longer think that is ever likely to happen, unless outside pressures force it to change (…such as a viable 3rd party run that steals away the Progressive wing and threatens to “hold it ransom” for a more left-leaning, reformed Democratic Party). But these things are matters of difference of opinion; of choices of tactics and strategies: Not of betrayal, or of hubris, naivety, immaturity, or calculated deceit.

For what results would we see if the detractors on the Left had their way? No Dennis in the White House anyway. As an Independent, probably out of Congress (although they are trying to do that now despite his loyalty to the real Party values, it appears that his seat will be safe). His voice no longer heard on the Floor, no longer a tempering “cop on the corner” factor to keep the other Democrat corporate hypocrite phonies in Congress from lying and forgetting their duty in too obvious a manner. When looking at Cynthia McKinney, it is difficult to argue that this course is any wiser than that which DK has taken.

Up until now that is….. When the monumental events of the ‘08 Primary have made everything that has happened in the past, the alleged betrayals of ‘04, moot. Impeachment; this explosive forbidden subject changed the rules… Fear of it and other dangerous topics being discussed forced Big Media to show it’s ugly hand of hidden control in obvious ways for all to see (as witnessed not just with DK but even more spectacularly with Ron Paul). And it has even forced the cowardly collaborators within the Democratic Party to try and dislodge one of their own; one of the few remaining honest souls who cannot be corrupted into silence. This is what has changed: The attack on Dennis from within the Party leadership itself. For make no mistake: Howard Dean and Pelosi do not want Dennis around to piss in their soup; they have made that clear by their actions (…or in Dean’s case total inaction while Kucinich was being necklaced). But as a lightening rod for these attacks, these enemies of the people have made the mistake of exposing themselves and revealing their true motives. So it would seem that in light of these events, after a 10th District Primary win DK can really say he has no more reason for loyalty; and that they have left him, and us , in the dust…. Trampled as the other Democrats run pell-mell to grab their corporate cash being dropped wholesale from low-flying planes on a summer’s day; like the candy-drop at an Annual County Democratic Picnic.

I cannot say if DK is interested in a 3rd party run now (or being part of a coalition movement as described above); if this betrayal of the party towards him has finally changed his mind or not. Perhaps no one but DK can say at this point. But if it hasn’t, i can understand even if i do not agree: For i know it is a difficult choice made after carefully weighing consequences and the potential for doing good.

Without seats in Congress and throughout localities this is just a parlor game.

Also, while I agree that Dennis has not made the ultimate moves away form the Dems, he has done a service and given a voice to issues.

As far as party building, look at how the Republican Party came into being in the mid-19th Century. It was a coalition. May be some lessons there.

If the aim is to defeat the Dems than I guess the unsafe is some kind of strategy. But 2000 left the Greens weakened on the national level. So, what are we trying to gain now?

Dennis is 04, and in 08, showed that the war profiteers, the insurance fat cats, and the incredibly greedy CEO’s that are behind the harmful policies that affect so many ordinary Americans … ever widening the gap between rich and poor.

The time to start a third party is now, gathering folks together … but we must vote for a Dem … either one … in Nov. 2008

… and then work like crazy, be ready, organized, and financed for 2012. There has already been mentioned on this blog … a lot of good ideas … starting locally for one.

It is the timing that is not right, this time around for the presidential spot … for one thing we have no momentum, no organization, basically no money, and there is no way that I can see this nation surviving 4 more years heading in the same direction, while a third party works out it’s kinks!

And to me … there still is a big, big difference between a Democrat … any Democrat, and a Republican, especially a John Mc Cain, running things. Gore, and Kerry, would have not done things quite like Bush II … no way in heck, no how … in my heart, I know that.

As for Dennis going down? John, I am usually with you, but Dennis went down years ago. He sold out his delegates in ‘04, backing Kerry. He essentially ran for office over the past four years and couldn’t garner over .01% of the vote. Pathetic. He helped derail the antiwar movement and is doing the same thing again.

Dennis, like the Democratic Party to which is a member, is a wash for progressive causes. We all know this. If Dennis believed in what he says and votes for, he would have left the Party long ago. But alas, he hasn’t. And for good reason. He’s a Democrat, not an activist.

No person who’s spent any significant amount of time within the Dem Party or Rep Party can compete with Ralph at this juncture. All you can do (electorally) is to vote your conscience at this point…and to get others to do so too, if you can. And that means taking an immediate break from this blah blah disease.

It doesn’t matter (enough) if any of the major candidates beats Ralph…which one of them is very likely to do, of course. What does matter is how you spend your “activist” time from here on out.

That’s completely correct. The Democratic Party complained bitterly about Nader in 2000, and we need to hit them again in just that way. Force them to be responsive to 3rd parties by moving to the left in order to capture votes from Nader. Nader shouldn’t be looking at success in terms of how many votes he gets but rather in how far the Democratic Party moved to the left to counter his efforts.

If the Democratic Party loses the presidency blame THEM for not moving far enough to the left to capture Nader votes, rather than blame Nader for “stealing votes”.

If the Democratic Party stood on a platform of single-payer health-care, severe reductions in greenhouse gas production, repeal of the Bush tax cuts, increased regulation of corporations, how many “Nader voters” would suddenly find themselves voting Democratic?

If the Democratic Party makes the wrong choice and hence Nader “steals their votes” they have only themselves to blame.

We have only two major weapons in our arsenal: speaking truth to both power and the people, and organizing at the grassroots to build powerful political organizations. If our candidates don’t speak the full truth, they’re doomed. Without organization, even with truth-telling candidates, we will be left with nothing.

Rep. Dennis Kucinich and his supporters, fail on both scores. Kucinich could never bring himself to speak the full truth to the people, even though he knows it well. The truth he wouldn’t or couldn’t tell, is that he never had any chance in the Democratic Primary. With the Democratic Party leaders and elites opposed to him, with the corporate media hostile to him, and with no way to even come close to raising the kind of money needed to compete in a cash dominated Democratic primary. Instead of telling us the truth, Kucinich chose to endulge an illusion. He told us that he could win the primary, and that he, and only he, could lead the Democratic Party to victory.

Kucinich also fails on the organizational score. Rather than work with us to build our own organization(s), uniting with those of us already engaged in this tremendously difficult task, he invited us into the corporate dominated Democratic Party. Wake up folks – the Democratic Party is where progressive social movements go to die. They invite us in, then smother us. Kucinich’s efforts not only do the left a disservice, they do the Democratic Party a huge service, by maintaining the fiction that there’s a place for the left within it. Then, following Kucinich’s entirely predictable humiliating defeat, he endorses a corporate Democrat.

Kucinich and, more importantly, his supporters need to ask themselves whose interests they are really serving.

There’s a simple truth here – leftist are not going to take over the Democratic Party. Not now, nor in the foreseeable future, because it is fundementally a corporate capitalist establishment party. I don’t ask you to like that, but I do ask you to deal with it. There are no short cuts.

The focus is not on the POTUS. We need agitators and real change agents at the congressional level. But while that’s going on all of this must be built solidly on a economic local transformative movement. Forget about left/right, blue/red boxes. Yea there are die hard facists who won’t hear of it, but we shouldn’t throw away whole groups in formative mode, searching for an alternative that makes sense. Keeping at bay the old right/left showstopping terminology that keeps us all stuck will allow the conversation to happen and the narrative to change.

All well and good, but Nader is not running, at this time, as a Green. The process for selecting a GP candidate has not completed. So, I don’t know how he provides anything for the GP – unless the status changes.

I have no qualms in the Dems loosing. I just think energies are better spent building coalitions, supporting movement building around more than one issue – Iraq, and begin at the grass-roots to make real change, build a base, stocking local, state and congressional seats with progressive/greens.

With State and Fed power the system can be re-constituted around proportional rep, and instant run-off voting. National focus does nothing to change the underlying problems. Regardless of who is in the WH, the problems are systemic and cannot be resolved at the national level.

Jerry, I think you’ve got some engaging and interesting ideas.

Max

I do believe we’d get tons of media coverage if the campaign focused on the “unsafe states.” A lot of Green issues and the Green name would get out there, at least in those states. Sure, some people would deride us as a spoiler, but we’d probably energize a lot more people too. And we’d be closer to our eventual goal of destroying the Democratic Party and ripping away its left base – which is something we need to be honest about. Running in Iowa, Michigan, Minnesota, New Hampshire, New Mexico, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, possibly Florida almost exclusively might attract enough voters to scare the crap out of the Dems in to an actual debate or discussion on the issues, at which point we could, post-election, expose them for frauds or potentially get them to take action on those issues.

A presidential campaign for a third party can’t do much to build an organization beyond media – that’s our job. I don’t like the dichotomy of either/or – either we run a presidential candidate, or a Congressional candidate, or local races. A presidential race will not drain resources for a local campaign – those campaigns will be run regardless of who’s running for president.

The national party is still incredibly disorganized. It’s not going to get more organized if we refuse to run a presidential candidate. The only advantage we’ll get is the ballot lines, potential funding in 2012, and possibly an energized base. Otherwise it’s silly to deride a presidential campaign for wrecking or disorienting the party – it can’t do any of that.

The reform candidates draw straws to see who is the actual candidate, but they all work together, all campaign equally hard as if they were the candidate. All will assume positions of power after the election, along with many elected officials and distinquished statesmen who will “defect” from the major parties when they see this excellent chance for real reform actually, and finally, happen.

The reform candidates should all seriously consider it: This is the ONLY hope for a third party to succeed, and maybe the only hope to rid us of this wholly-corrupt 2-party system we are stuck with now. Europeans have successful coalition governments all the time… Why must we be forced into two equally corrupt choices?

I implore our reform candidates to consider this (…as I have many times at other places and at their own sites) : We need you, your Country needs you. This is perhaps our best chance, THIS YEAR, 2008, to take back the government. You will be making sacrifices in ego and prestege perhaps, and risking much including personal danger. But as couragous Patriots, you will be serving our County in the best way possible. And “hanging together” has safety in itself.

The perfect time to announce the new party is right after the end of the conventions; when the pitiful mainstream party platforms are exposed for what they really are, and the fervor for the corporate candidates has waned. The problems of getting on 50 ballots are difficult, but not insurmountable: “Write-in’s” can still win states if the message gets out. And what a powerful message it is….

There are ways to get around Big Media, put it on the defensive, force it to cover the new coalition honestly. And there are ways to insure an honest vote. All it takes is huge numbers of energised and highly motivated people from all over the political spectrum working together for a critically important goal. A movement so revolutionary, so irresistable, that it has an excellent chance of sweeping all before it. One fueled by the tremendous indignation towards the lies, corruption, collusion, and creeping tyranny that is strangling our government, and destroying our country. One that rejects the Roman circus of the Red vs. Blue chariot races.