And, regarding Israel’s “right to exist”, since when do nation states have rights???

There are human rights, civil rights, etc., but national rights?

The claim to Israel’s right to exist is a thinly veiled claim to equating Judaism with Zionism, and to suggest that Israel speaks for all Jewish people and any who criticize Israel are anti-Semites, to associate them to Nazis, that if you don’t support the idea of a racist Jewish state then you advocate genocide.

The issue is not anti-Semitism, it is racist Jewish supremacy. Remember, when the U.N. created the nation of Israel, it also created the nation of Palestine, which the Zionists promptly began to invade and annex.

What of Palestine’s “right to exist”. Zionists say the Arabs want to push the Jews into the sea, but in truth it is the Zionists who are pushing the Palestinians into the desert, into prisons, into their graves.

What right have I to criticize Israel??? I’m an American worker whose taxes purchase Zionist aparteid. Though I didn’t ask for it, I paid for it and it is mine. I can say what I want about it, even if I am denied the right to decline the purchase.

Independent Jewish state my butt. try, racist welfare state.

I also resent that our tax money is being shipped off to a thriving economic country with a GDP per capita that is higher than Spain’s and New Zealand’s. Our tax money finances Israeli violations of international law as they use it to build illegal settlements, thereby increasing further hatred for the U.S.

So, you see, if you are an American in the least bit concerned over your country’s welfare and standing in the world, then you have to be incensed at our relationship with Israel.

Your obsession with Israel is based on pure tribalism which says volumes about your agenda.

That’s OK. If you don’t mind giving the impression of being mentally ill and pathologically obsessed with Jews and Israel. On this board, you’re in good company too.

Your like are actually fostering anti-semitism because you trivialize the label “anti-semite” to rhetorically silence critics of your zionist ideology. You do a great disservice to Jews everywhere. Your crying wolf at every discussion is grotesque and dishonest.

Your extreme ideology can’t win on its merits in the marketplace of ideas, so you conveniently try to cloak it as Judaism, the religion. Shame on you!!

And you bozos wonder why you don’t get taken seriously, other than as some kind of social problem.

Good luck.

Let’s look at a simple scenario using DV as an example.
Someone posts the assertion:

THE JEWS CONTROL THE US GOVERNMENT.

Let’s look at this for a second.
You can either accept it at face value, or wonder if it’s true, or how much of it’s true.

If it’s completely true, then “The Jews” presumably includes my cousin Sheldon, who works the night shift in a paper bag factory in Chico California. And my Aunt Yetta who is in palliative care in a hospital in Newark, NJ, with maybe 2 weeks to live.

If the Jews control the US government, how come nobody’s asked me about the Highway allocations for Madison Wisconsin, or this year’s budget for Yellowstone National Park?

I could go on. But if you’ve got more than one brain cell to rub together
i’s not hard to see that the above statement is ridiculously bigoted and uninformed.

Do Jews get organized and lobby the government? Yes they do.
And so do Muslims, weapons manufacturers, “big” tobacco, egg producers, porno distributors and manufacturers of mouse traps.

And it doesn’t grant you an automatic ” free pass” in world outside DV.

If you’re making patently false claims about Jews and get outed, then depending upon the venue, expect to get called out for it.

>> You know as well as everyone here that the ADL and Israeli Lobby are trying to censor anyone on campus who speaks of the Israeli Lobby. Now you try and use that as some sort of proof to discredit the merit of their book. It ONLY makes their case outlined in their book.

So they resort to general anti-semitic stereotyping like your statement “‘The Israel lobby’ has been popular in conspiracy circles such as here at DV and among white supremacists”

Their documentation is impeccable and I have actually read the book, unlike yourself, so you are in NO position to judge the book’s merit. Just continue to spew your dishonest Zionist propaganda. But be careful about continuing to use the “anti-semite” card too much. Remember the moral of “The Boy Who Cried Wolf” story. It’s relevance is becoming more and more important these days.

I think wikipedia does a good job.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Israel_Lobby_and_U.S._Foreign_Policy

White supremacist David Duke likes their report.

Noam Chomsky (who is widely revered here on DV) felt that the authors “have a highly selective use of evidence (and much of the evidence is assertion)”, ignores historical “world affairs”, and blames the Lobby for issues that are not relevant.

I asked Espresso to substantiate his remark with some specific evidence. So we’ll conclude that the response so far received is an evasion.

These guys don’t leave a stone unturned. I promise you that if you read it you will see that Israel Lobbyists DO control US middle east policy.

But if you have something to substantiate that remark, then let’s see it.

Israel thus has a very unique welfare and “tail wag the dog” relationship with the U.S. so therefore it’s expected that they’ll uphold our moral standards (pre George W. Bush morals, that is) than the dictatorial China and the fundamentally Islamic Iran.

ie: the quote from Condi Rice in the LA Times Oct 16th to the effect that the Pals need to recognie the existence of Israel if they want to get anywhere.

No name calling in that. But maybe it was deleted by Kim or another mod with higher (or lower) standards than you..

For some reason I keep running into problems because I actually have this funny idea that DV should reflect “the struggle for peace and social justice.” Kinda by definition, the idea of being for “peace” means peace for everybody and a degree of acceptance, and not just a bunh of hysterical name-calling.

Or leave the hysterical hate crap up and be known as a toilet. Either way it doesn’t matter to me. I’m mainly interested in studying your patterns and trends. Especially the really dumb ones.

ie: blaming the Burma humanitarian disaster on Israel, the chief “evidence” being that Israel maybe did some arms deals with the junta like 8 years ago..

Another truly disreputable thing is to leave obvious libels in place after they’ve been debunked.

ie: Israeli rape of Palestinians, and allegedly ” salting” Palestinian soil.
When these were challenged for substantiation, 2 things happened.

First, the posters without substantiation slid sideways mumbling something about meaning these bogus assertions “figuratively,” and second, my posts were deleted.

Think about that one, Hue.